2142) The American Police State By Chris Hedges

A Dallas jury, a week ago, deadlocked in its deliberations and caused a mistrial in the government case against this country's largest Islamic charity. The action raises a defiant fist on the sinking ship of American democracy.

If we lived in a state where due process and the rule of law could curb the despotism of the Bush administration, this mistrial might be counted a victory. But we do not. The jury may have rejected the federal government's claim that the Holy Land Foundation for Relief and Development funneled millions of dollars to Middle Eastern terrorists. It may have acquitted Mohammad el-Mezain, the former chairman of the foundation, of virtually all criminal charges related to funding terrorism (the jury deadlocked on one of the 32 charges against el-Mezain), and it may have deadlocked on the charges that had been lodged against four other former leaders of the charity, but don't be fooled. This mistrial will do nothing to impede the administration's ongoing contempt for the rule of law. It will do nothing to stop the curtailment of our civil liberties and rights. The grim march toward a police state continues.

Constitutional rights are minor inconveniences, noisome chatter, flies to be batted away on the steady road to despotism. And no one, not the courts, not the press, not the gutless Democratic opposition, not a compliant and passive citizenry hypnotized by tawdry television spectacles and celebrity gossip, seems capable of stopping the process. Those in power know this. We, too, might as well know it.

The Bush administration, which froze the foundation's finances three months after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks and indicted its officials three years later on charges that they provided funds for the militant group Hamas, has ensured that the foundation and all other Palestinian charities will never reopen in the United States . Any organized support for Palestinians from within the U.S. has been rendered impossible. The goal of the Israeli government and the Bush administration—despite the charade of peace negotiations to be held at Annapolis —is to grind defiant Palestinians into the dirt. Israel , which has plunged the Gaza Strip into one of the world's worst humanitarian crises, has now begun to ban fuel supplies and sever electrical service. The severe deprivation, the Israelis hope, will see the overthrow of the Hamas government in Gaza and the reinstatement of Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, who has become the Marshal Pétain of the Palestinian people.

The Dallas trial—like all of the major terrorism trials conducted by this administration, from the Florida case against the Palestinian activist Dr. Sami al-Arian, which also ended in a mistrial, to the recent decision by a jury in Chicago to acquit two men of charges of financing Hamas—has been a judicial failure. William Neal, a juror in the Dallas trial, told the Associated Press that the case "was strung together with macaroni noodles. There was so little evidence."

Such trials, however, have been politically expedient. The accusations, true or untrue, serve the aims of the administration. A jury in Tampa , Chicago or Dallas can dismiss the government's assaults on individual rights, but the draconian restrictions put in place because of the mendacious charges remain firmly implanted within the system. It is the charges, not the facts, which matter.

Dr. al-Arian, who was supposed to have been released and deported in April, is still in a Virginia prison because he will not testify in a separate case before a grand jury. The professor, broken by the long ordeal of his trial and unable to raise another million dollars in legal fees for a retrial, pleaded guilty to a minor charge in the hopes that his persecution would end. It has not. Or take the case of Canadian citizen Maher Arar, who in 2002 was spirited away by Homeland Security from JFK Airport to Syria , where he spent 10 months being tortured in a coffin-like cell. He was, upon his release, exonerated of terrorism. Arar testified before a House panel this month about how he was abducted by the U.S. and interrogated, stripped of his legal rights and tortured. But he couldn't testify in person. He spoke to the House members on a video link from Canada . He is forbidden by Homeland Security to enter the United States because he allegedly poses a threat to national security.

Those accused of being involved in conspiracies and terrorism plots, as in all police states, become nonpersons. There is no rehabilitation. There is no justice.

"He was never given a hearing nor did the Canadian consulate, his lawyer, or his family know of his fate," Amnesty International wrote of Arar. "Expulsion in such circumstances, without a fair hearing, and to a country known for regularly torturing their prisoners, violates the U.S. Government's obligations under international law, specifically the Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman, or Degrading Treatment or Punishment."

You can almost hear Dick Cheney yawn.

The Bush administration shut down the Holy Land Foundation for Relief and Development six years ago and froze its assets. There was no hearing or trial. It became a crime for anyone to engage in transactions with the foundation. The administration never produced evidence to support the charges. It did not have any. In the "war on terror," evidence is unnecessary. An executive order is enough. The foundation sued the government in a federal court in the District of Columbia . Behind closed doors, the government presented secret evidence that the charity had no opportunity to see or rebut. The charity's case was dismissed.

The government has closed seven Muslim charities in the United States and frozen their assets. Not one of them, or any person associated with them, has been found guilty of financing terrorism. They will remain shut. George W. Bush can tar any organization or individual, here or abroad, as being part of a terrorist conspiracy and by fiat render them powerless. He does not need to make formal charges. He does not need to wait for a trial verdict. Secret evidence, which these court cases have exposed as a sham, is enough. The juries in Tampa , Chicago and Dallas did their duty. They spoke for the rights of citizens. They spoke for the protection of due process and the rule of law. They threw small hurdles in front of the emergent police state. But the abuse rolls on. I fear terrorism. I know it is real. I am sure terrorists will strike again on American soil. But while terrorists can wound and disrupt our democracy, only we can kill it.

Oct 29, 2007 By Chris Hedges

#111041 by Inherit The Wind on 11/01 at 6:45 pm
(17 comments total)

Nancy on 11/01 at 3:23 pm

The Jews were also lost in the Desert for forty years. You also have to take into account that they rejected GOD’S son, Jesus. Who created a new convenant. I don’t think that old biblical law is still valid today. After all, a true Christian doesn’t delibrately break both man’s AND GOD’S laws. Because as many of us believers believe; GOD still speaks today. And the fact that they destroyed their temple by killing Jesus. The bible also says that the sins of the fathers follow their children to many generations....

I just LOVE the venal idiots that post here--claiming to be “Christian” she doesn’t even know that Jesus was a DEVOUT Jew--practicing Torah in his life. In fact, the ONLY time Jesus violated or stretch Torah, was to commit an act of mercy “Let he who is without sin first cast the stone”. Jesus never said “Torah law is no longer valid”. It is an act of EXTREME ego to say that God’s Law, given to Moses, was just a patchwork “Just for now” job--as if God wasn’t capable of giving Law that was valid forever.

If you believe that God’s Law wasn’t forever, then the ONLY logical path for you is to be either an Atheist or Agnostic. Instead you just make up the usual bullshit “‘Cuz Jesus came we don’ hafta follow God’s Law anymore”.

#111037 by Howard on 11/01 at 6:35 pm
(142 comments total)

RE:#110996 by Nancy on 11/01 at 3:23 pm

“ GOD still speaks today. And the fact that they destroyed their temple by killing Jesus. The bible also says that the sins of the fathers follow their children to many generations.... “

A VERY dispicable comment. Not in place on this particular web site. Or any web-site that I know of.

#111023 by WR Curley on 11/01 at 6:07 pm

I did 14 months in-country in the north, about 6 kliks from the Lebanon border. Israel was engaged, for a part of that time, in one of its periodic incursions into the no-man’s land of shifting militias and refugee camps north of the border. In the late dusk, tanks rang the asphalt on the two lane running between the Kibbutz and the sea. By day, long guns lodged on the ridges pounded away at Palestinian...something. Who knows. Emplacements? Those ragged, ill-equipped Arab bands ranging the thorn-scrub can’t have had much to emplace. Long guns pounding the shit out of something up there. And in the high thin blue, French-built Israeli war planes winked silver in the sun, rising and turning and falling, like flakes of mica, winking in the high far away.

The first time the Katusha rockets came into the Kibbutz, I helped rouse people from their beds and shepherd them to the shelter in the bunker under the dining hall. The rockets uprooted a few banana trees, some avocados. We picked up souvenir fragments in the morning.

The second night I was in the shower, the bath house candle-lit, for serenity, and to celebrate the warm dark. When the sirens sounded incoming, I just turned my face up into the steaming stream. Quietly took my time and finished my daily ablution. Katusha’s? You can’t aim them things. What are the odds? I could hear them dropping in, intermittently, making a brave carnage of the citrus groves.

This warfare, Israeli to Palestinian, is so laughably asymmetric, you may as well relax, and enjoy the long dark walk down to the shelter, a sweet breeze with a faint spice of cordite easing in from the sea.

Don’t let anyone tell you that a tank assault on a civilian population, backed by hellfire missiles, is an appropriate retaliatory response to a few lame flights of home-made bang-toys. Any ordinance can kill you, sure. That’s what they’re built for. But don’t weep for the Israelis in this decades-long campaign to carve a nation out of the Arab flank. They do not share your tears.

WR Curley
Elizabeth, Colorado

#110996 by Nancy on 11/01 at 3:23 pm

The Jews were also lost in the Desert for forty years. You also have to take into account that they rejected GOD’S son, Jesus. Who created a new convenant. I don’t think that old biblical law is still valid today. After all, a true Christian doesn’t delibrately break both man’s AND GOD’S laws. Because as many of us believers believe; GOD still speaks today. And the fact that they destroyed their temple by killing Jesus. The bible also says that the sins of the fathers follow their children to many generations....

#110977 by Howard on 11/01 at 12:58 pm
(142 comments total)

#110938 by WriterOnTheStorm on 11/01 at 9:47 am
(29 comments total)

What do you mean by ‘land grab’ ?

The Palestine to which European Jews in the 1870’s and 1880’s immigrated was vstly underpopulatd, and the land onto which the Jews moved was, in fact, bought primarily from absentee landlords and real estate speculators. This was separate from the indiginous Jewish villages and presence that had been there since the first century. Certainly there were Arab villages, as well; but there was no land grab.
It is impossible to reconstruct the demographics of the area with any degree of precision, since census data for that time period are not reliable, and most attempts at reconstruction--by both Palestinian adn Israeli sources --- seem to have a political agenda.

In addition to Palestine being an appropriate place for Jewish refugees because of its close connection to their history and ideology, it was also seen as appropriate because of the demographics of the land to which they were moving, or in their word, returning.
Mark Twain,who visited Palestine in 1867, offerered a description of emptiness and 10 or more miles between clusters of Bedouin tents. This all throughout the Galilee and around Nazareth, Jericho, and Bethlehem. Certainly there were

Other travelers recorded similar accounts of Palestine around 1880 prior to the arrival of the Jews of the First Immigration., who began the process of revitalizing the land and increasing its population by creating jobs and infrastructure.

#110974 by Inherit The Wind on 11/01 at 12:50 pm
(17 comments total)

As usual, Hedges COULD have had a BRILLIANT article except his constant neo-nazi “and it’s all the fault of the Jews in Israel”.

Like this:
The goal of the Israeli government and the Bush administration—despite the charade of peace negotiations to be held at Annapolis—is to grind defiant Palestinians into the dirt. Israel, which has plunged the Gaza Strip into one of the world’s worst humanitarian crises, has now begun to ban fuel supplies and sever electrical service. The severe deprivation, the Israelis hope, will see the overthrow of the Hamas government in Gaza and the reinstatement of Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, who has become the Marshal Pétain of the Palestinian people.

Actually, he left out the KEY portion: The grinding into the dirt is COMPLETELY a response to continual attacks on Israel from Gaza. Israel GAVE the Gaza back the Palestinians. They didn’t hermatically seal it off--that was BECAUSE of the terrorists--the rockets to terrorize the Israeli population and the tunneling to illegally get Hamaz terrorists into Israel. All they EVER had to do was STOP--but they wouldn’t and now @$$#ole$ like Hedges condemn them for defending themselves.

And the ditto-heads here pile on.

The sad thing is that Hedges is otherwise TOTALLY correct in his assessment of the terrible march to fascism and the refusal of the Bush White House to accept even LEGAL challenges to what they “know”. Once the WH says someone’s a terrorist or a threat--that’s it. No court, no law, no nothing changes that.

After all, George W. Bush consults with God.

This would have been and should have been a brilliant article. Now it’s just another hate-the-Jews screed.

#110965 by Tom Panaetius on 11/01 at 12:01 pm

Well done Chris.

“The greatest thing a man can do for humanity is tell them the truth - whether it be sweet or bitter.”

Every man who says frankly and fully what he thinks is doing a public service.

Thank you Truthdig for another enlightening report.

#110962 by Aretologist on 11/01 at 11:44 am
(16 comments total)

"?The hour of their crime does not strike simultaneously for all nations. This explains the continuation and permanence of history.” E. M. Cioran

#110940 by WR Curley on 11/01 at 10:07 am

Let’s not get personal. It coarsens the discourse.

I’m not anti-Semitic (whatever that means...modern Jewry carries the genetic legacy of multi-millennial blood-mixing with Baltic, Slavic, and European tribal stocks. I’ve known - and loved - any number of blonde, blue-eyed Jews. A good many European-descended Israelis have an ugly habit of belittling their more “Semitic” Sephardim brethren. “Kushi” is the term, isn’t it? How would you characterize that tendency, I wonder).

I don’t believe in UFO’s any more than I believe in a God-Who’s-Name-Must-Not-Be-Spoken. I wouldn’t presume to tell you what you believe.

What I earnestly do believe is that it’s high time for an open, national debate about the knee-jerk support the US accords Israel. Resorting to schoolyard insults doesn’t much help.

I commend you for your suggestion that folks ought to pick up the King James from time to time. It’s a great read. Those who haven’t had the pleasure should get right to it, before someone thinks to redact the New Testament.

How to tie these off-topic scraps to the lead article? Try this: Chertoff and Mukasey are Jews. If the prospective AG learns to surf the waterboard, they will soon share control of the US national security aparatus. These websites are certainly monitored. How can I know whether a public accusation of anti-Semitism won’t land me on a watchlist, or worse? That’s right. I can’t.

Thanks for the attention. I’m flattered

WR Curley
Elizabeth, Colorado

#110938 by WriterOnTheStorm on 11/01 at 9:47 am
(29 comments total)

Judging from the way the ADL spammers have hijacked this thread, they must really be worried about the fallout from Mearsheimer and Walt. So here we go.....

Israel is engaging in a religion and racist fueled land grab, pure and simple. It is good old fashioned conquest.

But before some of you throw a brick at your computer screen, allow me to put this into perspective. From a moral standpoint, what Israel is doing in the region formerly known as Palestine is roughly on par with what the Dutch did in South Africa, what the Belgians did in Congo, or what the British did in Rhodesia, Kenya and a dozen other places. Indeed, Israel has on occasion, evinced great restraint when compared to these other colonizers. Further, what Israel is doing, even by conservative estimates, is less a crime than what we have done right here to our own native Americans. Yet, with the exception of South Africa, we have chosen to closet these historical aggressions, or to compartmentalize them as distant history.

This said, I’ll elaborate on what makes this particular colonization effort different, and why the US continues to support it at its peril.

1. We are living in a time when such imperialistic impulses are no longer acceptable. If Theodore Hertzl had made his move just 75 years sooner, the Palestinians would have been completely and utterly subjugated, and no one in the international community would have even raised an eyebrow. But unfortunately for them, the great age of civilizing savages has past. We now (perhaps owing to the epic struggle to end apartheid) consider this behavior to be only marginally better than slave ownership.

2. The advent of computers and the subsequent ease of information dissemination has lifted the political awareness of Arabs and muslims (and many other oppressed people throughout the world, btw). This means that local populations now fully understand the nature of their oppression. At the same time, they have new ways to connect to a community of concerned observers to whom they can appeal for assistance and support.

3. Technology has given rise to new forms of military resistance. These new methods, often referred to as ‘terrorist tactics’, afford even a miniscule number of motivated fighters to create effective resistance movements. But more than this, it constitutes an entirely new level of danger to the colonizers—and their perceived supporters. Further, because these resistance fighters are more informed than ever, they understand that certain allies of the colonizer may be abetting the repression. If it is fair for the US president to say that aiding terrorist makes you a terrorist state, then it is equally fair for the terrorist to reason that if you are aiding our oppressor, you are also our oppressor.

What I’m getting at here should be obvious by now. The United State, for its support and enabling of Israel, is now considered a legitimate target of the resistance. The stakes have been raised. This alone is not an argument to stop defending Israel. But when it is combined with the fact that the actions of Israel are not, for the most part, justifiable, and that gross and demonstrable human rights violations are routinely committed with US approval, then the only reasonable and morally correct conclusion is that our support of Israel is no longer tenable, and must be reconsidered.

It is morally reprehensible to support a country that proves tireless in its repressive practices. This destroys our credibility as a nation, and seriously erodes our international standing. But when we allow that country’s proponents here at home to blackmail our politicians, when we expose our citizenry to fear and military reprisals stemming from this support, we are simply hapless, irresponsible patsies.

#110896 by rowman on 11/01 at 6:59 am
(40 comments total)

Its way off topic but interesting nonetheless. I will apologize up front for being so direct but sometimes you have to call a shoe a shoe.

WR Curley, cyrena, you could not be more wrong on the issue. Your posts are nothing more than your misinterpretation of the facts, biblical history and the Muslim / Jewish debate. The flippin history you accuse others of rewriting is exactly what you are doing. Whatever your source, its wrong.

Howard is correct. If you studied history you would have a better understanding of how correct he is. Take the time to educate yourself before attacking him. This will require that you study something beyond your anti-semetic rags and UFO conspiracy theory comic books. Pick up the bible, study the overwhelming archeological evidence that supports it. Once you get past your bias, you will quickly realize the lie you are trying to perpetuate.

I appreciate David Balmer’s post as well. Note the two verses he provided

#110886 by Leefeller on 11/01 at 5:38 am
(467 comments total)

Humility should start at home, pointing the finger at others is not a good start.

#110867 by Howard on 11/01 at 4:14 am
(142 comments total)

RE: 110852
by Weather

Is the comment a pro Israel statement? or an anti-Israel statement?
Not writen too clearly and hard to tell. Either way what does it have to do with the essay above by Hedges?

#110852 by weather on 11/01 at 2:54 am
(194 comments total)

Ireland declares Peace and they’re afforded but a footnote.

Israel develops yet another impacted cyst and we have to hear about it as if we care, when we don’t at all.
So take your Teva’s, your Carnival Cruise lines including Princess/Cunnard, your Plaza Hotel, your knock-off drugs, your Uzi’s and sell your wares, your resentments and your selfish dramas elsewhere.
Israel’s made for TV wars and faux nobility is just that. A sad and very selfish country that fell in love w/its own headlines. Keep lying to yourselves Israel and to everyone else, its what you do best.

#110850 by WR Curley on 11/01 at 2:19 am

The direction this series of posts has taken is way off point, but that, in itself, is interesting.

I lived in Israel for a while, soaking up the local scene, curious about the sources of the global phenomena resonating from that fraught little patch of dust.

I could tell you much.

Suffice for the moment to say...Israelis believe that they are God’s pioneers, carving out the pre-destined homeland for His Chosen in the desert. They believe that His Will is Manifest in their works, a familiar American doctrine. In the pursuit of this destiny, they trust no one but the Jews, and they trust the Jews implicitly.

You will not change this mind-set. This is ancient dogma, founded on the tomb of Abraham.

Never mind that Islam founds its dogma on this self-same tomb.

The Jew is a tribal entity, risen each generation from the mother-blood of its ancestor. An ancient idea, this, vitally compelling to its adherents, and of no use whatever in the modern materialist global marketplace. Thus, the dissonance. Thus, the dysfunction. Thus, the discord.

No one denies the Jews the right to be who they are. We ought, however, to question the right of the Jews to do as they will. When their self-sanctioned imperatives conflict with the common good, our path is clear.

Theirs is an ancient and reverent tradition. But it is not the only ancient and reverent tradition. It is high time they were reminded of this self-evident truth.

You must not build walls. You must build bridges. If you cannot build bridges, you must confess your incompetence, and let those who can, do.

These folks look ripe for a smack-down. God has done this repeatedly, if you buy into their Bible. They over-reach, they are uncharitable and impious, they get whacked. Looks to be about time for another trip to the woodshed. But I’ll leave that to their G*d.

WR Curley
Elizabeth, Colorado

#110827 by cyrena on 10/31 at 8:32 pm
(1422 comments total)

#110772 by Nancy on 10/31 at 2:58 pm

I have to admit, I have been conflicted and confused on this issue. But my question is; who gave Israel to the Jews?

Not to worry. You are not the only one confused. The confusion is very intentional, as you can tell from the most recent lies from Howard. It’s seems like a genetic thing with these people, to flippin’ RE-WRITE HISTORY!!! And, it’s annoying at best, because most folks don’t have time to sit down and actually READ and study this stuff. (Because believe me, it takes a while). But, since I had nothing better to do after the PURGES of thousands and thousands of Americans from their long term employment over the past several years, I figured I might as well try to figure out why we (here in the US) had become such targets of hatred, and while Israel had been committing these crimes against humanity for so long, and getting away with it for just as long.
So, as only a ‘beginning’ sort of the story…(there are multiple places where you can get the specifics, and it’s worth it, even if it takes a while) here is the basic answer. The United Nations gave Israel to the Jews/Zionists in 1948. It was NOT called ‘Israel then” nor was it a ‘State” of Palestine. It was referred to as Palestine, and the Arabs/Palestinians had lived there for at least 10,000 years. You could probably go back to the beginning of the Old Testament, to trace when the Jews HAD been in the area, and left. (It seems they were run out by warring factions, but I can’t remember who they were now. Probably Christians, since Christians seem to have the bloodiest record for wars based ostensibly on the furtherance of Christianity).
WHATEVER the case, by 1917, the area known then as Palestine, was primarily inhabited by Arabs, (called Palestinians) and there were also a smattering of Christians and Jews as well. Not many. By 1948, the Zionists had moved in – in mass numbers, coming primarily from Europe, and Russia, to escape conditions that were obviously unfavorable to them, considering what Hilter did to so many.
So, after the end of WWII, the UN (or maybe they were still the League of Nations then, I have to check my dates) GAVE the territory then known as Palestine, (and under British rule) to the Jews, because of all that Hitler and Stalin and some other nasty dudes had put them through in the lead-up to WWII. (and of course EVERYBODY on the planet knows of those atrocities inflicted upon the Jews at the time.)

How or why it is that they wound up giving them what was then Palestine, (as opposed to Germany, or Poland, or half of Russia) is because…that’s what they wanted and demanded. The Zionist leader (from way back in 1917, and I can’t remember his name – maybe intentionally) had already dreamed this up to be “THE perfect spot for a State of Israel”. And, while it’s true that the Palestine of the time was in fact under British Mandate, (howies right about that) it is false that the Jews had been there continuously for all of those thousands of years. Matter of fact, it’s a lie. A lie among many lies.
I’ll add some interesting reading material if you’re interested later. There is actually far more available in recent years…(that provides a real history), than there has been up to this point.
Still, since the UN DID give the space to Israel, they took it, (which basically they already had…because they’d already begun to run out all of the Palestinians) and they took it, and as we know since…oh so very much more. That’s why Israel still doesn’t have a Constitution, to this very day. It refuses to define it’s borders, because it has occupied far more territory than it was initially gifted by the International organization, as compensation for the troubles endured in EUROPE. Go figure.

#110813 by Howard on 10/31 at 7:17 pm
(142 comments total)

The state of Israel was legally created out of the dismemberment of the Ottoman Empire at the end of World War I. The area was desolate – desert and swamp – with some small towns and a few inhabitants, many of them nomads. The inhabitants, if they thought about it at all, considered themselves Syrians. The legitimacy of Israel arises from the Balfour Declaration issued by the British, who were given the mandate over the area by the League of Nations. Jews have lived in the country since Biblical times. The Arabs from the surrounding areas were lured to “Palestine” by the industry and prosperity that the Jews brought to the region. Envy, hatred, and religious fanaticism turned the Arabs against the Jews. In bloody outrages, horrible massacres, killings and rapes, the Arabs tried to dislodge the Jews, but were unable to do so.
In 1947, the British, having tired of the trouble and the bloodshed, resigned their mandate. That same year, the United Nations mandated partitioning of the territory. The Jews, though disappointed, accepted the partition. The Arabs rejected it out of hand and launched war against Israel. The armies of five Arab countries invaded the nascent state. Following the exhortations of the invaders, the Arab residents got out of the way hoping to return after victory was attained. They could then reclaim their property and that of the Jews, all of whom would have been killed or would have fled. That and that alone is the source of the Arab “refugee problem.”

#110811 by musings on 10/31 at 7:11 pm

Okay Howard, now you’re starting to get on my nerves. I own a house in a New England state in the US. I wasn’t born here. I was born elsewhere. My neighbors vary in their tenure of ownership. One person inherited her house from her mother. But compared to them, I am much more of a native. Why, I can trace my New England ancestry back to the Pilgrims. And they—well, they are upstarts, migrants who wandered in from Ireland about five generations ago. Originally, they were only tenants of other people, didn’t own a bean. I mean what are they anyway? They’re only immigrants, a few generations removed. Shouldn’t I reclaim my ancestral lands and boot them out? After all, the Indians who lived here died off in various epidemics, leaving my ancestors the field - and the religious authority too. They built churches that are still here - not just wailing walls.

Now let’s say I started a program to expell Catholics and to denigrate their contributions to the land. That would make me an as***le.

And of course, the Puritans that were went through a lot of changes since then. A whole bunch of them became surfers in California, like some of my kinfolk. All have suffered a sea-change. None of them has the right of return to the Bay Colony in order to oust the inhabitants because of pride of place.

And that little hypothetical is just for starters, Howard.

Are you sure the “Arabs” are all one indistinguishable mass? Are you justified in such simplistic thinking as a responsible adult? Are you qualified to teach us with your expertise on the subject? Or is it simply convenient to abuse their history in that fashion?

#110800 by weather on 10/31 at 6:14 pm
(194 comments total)

Nancy if that happens we all move in w/Howard, cause everday will be in Halloween Hell.

#110795 by David Balmer on 10/31 at 5:48 pm

Actually, G-d has already spoken on the issue. There are many references to the land boundary in the Torah / Tanach (Old Testament ). Example:

“On that day, G-d made with Abram a covenant saying, ‘To your seed, I have given this land from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates.” (Genesis 15:18)

It is the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob who established this covenant with his chosen people, the Jews.

The Jews lost temporary possession of the land due to disobedience and were scattered amongst the nations. G-d does promise the return of the land and the re gathering of his people but it does not mean that this is the same fulfillment we see today. Britain gave control over portions of the land to the Jews and the nation of Israel was born. The borders of the land under the original agreement with Britain increased shortly after the turn over when they were forced to defend themselves. Still, they do not have possession of all the land as G-d promised and thus, we are still waiting to see the fulfillment of this.

For those whom I see that repeatedly curse the Jewish people let me point out a couple verses…

Genesis 12:3
And I will bless them that bless thee,
and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee
shall all families of the earth be blessed.

PSALM 122:6

#110772 by Nancy on 10/31 at 2:58 pm

I have to admit, I have been conflicted and confused on this issue. But my question is; who gave Israel to the Jews? Did they always possess it or did Germany give it to them in compensation for their aniliation? And, how could Germany do that? The only answer I can seem to find is that the Jews keep saying GOD gave them that land. I asked HIM; and he ain’t talkin’. On the subject of Bush, a thought also ocurred to me: What if Bush refuses to leave office when his time is up?

#110770 by Howard on 10/31 at 2:53 pm
(142 comments total)

There is no such thing as a “Palestinian people.” That is a concept that, by the drumbeat of incessant propaganda, has been foisted on the world. The so-called Palestinians are the same Arabs that live in Syria, Jordan and Lebanon. Never at any time in history did the “Palestinians” have a homeland, nor did they ever demand one.

In 1947, the United Nations General Assembly voted to set up both a Jewish and an Arab state within the borders of the territories. The Arabs were allotted three contiguous areas and the enclave of the city of Jaffa. The Jews were allotted three discontiguous areas. Jerusalem was to be an international city. In order to get their homeland, the Jews reluctantly accepted the unfavorable deal. The Arabs rejected it out of hand and instead invaded the nascent Jewish state with the armies of six nations. The ragtag Jewish forces decisively defeated the aggressors and stayed in control of most of the area. Egypt retained control of the Gaza Strip, and Jordan occupied Judea/Samaria (the “West Bank”). Had the Arabs accepted the United Nations partition plan, they would have had their “Palestinian homeland” for almost 60 years. They spurned the opportunity when it was available to them.

For nineteen years, until the Six-Day War, the territories involved were under the control of Jordan and Egypt. Never during those years was there ever a demand for a “Palestinian homeland.” Only after the Six-Day War in 1967, when the territories reverted to Israeli control, did the insistent clamor for a “Palestinian homeland” arise.

#110769 by TMoodie on 10/31 at 2:47 pm

#110242 and #110209
Howard, Lee and others (where’s Lefty?) seem to unable to resist smuggling the faux logique into their posts. Their latest little beauty makes ample use of two classic logic fallacies:

1. the bare assertion fallacy. By simply asserting that posters are “blaming Israel for everything”, they want readers to accept this as fact. But I have been unable to find a single post anywhere on TD which claims a Unified Theory of Blame for Israel. In fact most posters are quite specific in their accusations.

2. the false dilemma fallacy. Part two of their argument goes like this. You have a choice, either Israel is guilty of everything, or it is guilty of nothing.

Tactics such as these are either a fool’s ploy, or they are taking the readers of these threads as fools.

Howard and Lee, I feel your pain. Why can’t you relax, and enjoy the ride? After all, aren’t those your boys at the wheel?

#110764 by WR Curley on 10/31 at 2:23 pm

Look, I don’t as a rule respond to these posts, but I am curious...Howard, bud, are you mailing in from Israel? Or from somewhere in the moist cleft of the downy bosom of the American protectorate? Are you aware that New York has a larger Jewish population than Tel Aviv? Why is that? I mean, if Israel is the hard-won homeland of the Chosen People, why do two-thirds of world Jewry choose to live outside the concrete, mine-sown borders of the Promised Land? To maintain the much-vilified Diaspora rather than to relocate to that tin-pot ethnocratic, jew-built ghetto hammered into the heel of the Mediterranean?

What you posit as argument is in fact faith-based dogma, and there is no arguing with faith.

If you are in Israel, well, enjoy your life-sustaining stipend of US aid, and your view of the graffiti on the ghetto wall. And if you are in the US, for chrissake, show a little gratitude. We allow all kinds to participate here. Even a dual-loyalty Zionist can enjoy full citizenship here. We have no tribal test. You do not have to prove maternal bloodline. The whole point to the American experiment is to open the society to every ethnicity. In this, our strength.

Israel, by contrast, defines itself as a state reserved for the Jews. This is antithetical to the American ideal. Confess that much, and I’ll accept your participation in the debate.

Otherwise, butt out. Assimilate or emigrate, my man. It’s the American way.

WR Curley
Elizabeth, Colorado

#110761 by The Village Idiot on 10/31 at 2:12 pm
(7 comments total)

Howard: The firestorms in California were al qaeda; I saw that on Fox News. Seriously.

Regarding the comment “20 large Arab lands surround Israel with 100 X the population,” that’s true but begs some questions: Why did they put it there then? Because of Jerusalem? Who was living there before 1948? Sure, there were “Israelis” since before Roman times, but things change, countries/regions get conquered, crap happens; so why did Israel get to have theirs back? Shouldn’t the US then be likewise giving North America back to the people who were here since before Roman times?

#110748 by WR Curley on 10/31 at 1:37 pm

This guy Spirko’s a stitch. Gives me a chuckle. He proceeds from the hypothetical to accepted truth built on the hypothetical to policy imperatives built on the accepted truth built on the hypothetical. This propagandist’s technique, bald though it may be, has become the chosen modality for the administration and the media.

Apply logic, people. Be rigorous. Demand fact rooted in verifiable research. Don’t take “...said by many to be...”, or “...accepted by experts as...” or any such-like drivel to stand in for journalistic rigor. “Many officials close to the situation believe...” implies that many others believe nothing of the kind. Let’s get a grip. When you read or hear one of these sorts of phrases in a news story, understand that you are being snowed. React with utmost skepticism. Ask yourself why the source of the story wants to control your world view. Who do they work for. What agenda governs the choices of the people they work for. Get names. Check backgrounds. Read what they’ve laid out in the public record.

“The press is only free if you own one,” some one said in the long ago and far away. Absolutely true.

Since the Reagan reforms of media regulation, fewer and fewer people - actual, individual, blood and bone human beings - control more and of the media. And there is a current movement afoot within the Bush/Cheney FCC to allow even greater consolidation. Pretty soon, here, the entire national broadcast net could be controlled from a single poker table at a post-Bar Mitzvah party.

A few years ago, there was a short-lived move afoot to break out interstitial radio wave bands between the current bands in use. I don’t pretend to understand this technically, but it would have been (still is) possible for tiny local stations to broadcast to tiny local audiences. The big boys jumped on this with both feet. It would have created thousands of independent voices competing with their consolidated corporate onevoice. It would have been possible for them to buy up all these wave bands I suppose, but that would have been expensive, messy, and of dubious value. So the media giants had their congressional hirelings kill the idea. Too bad. I can imagine “Radio Elizabeth”, goofy, quirky, idiosyncratic, gracing the airwaves of a slow Sunday morn. Not one mention of Israel the livelong day. Just imagine. What a mercy.

WR Curley
Elizabeth, Colorado

#110743 by Howard on 10/31 at 1:22 pm
(142 comments total)

RE: 110713
by Karim

AWRIGHT, so glad for the info. That means that the Zionists are responsible for the sun coming up in the East, too. Right?
and for the Aids disease, and firestorms in CA, too,right?
Awesome stuff. And the Katrina hurricane. Certainly.
Glad we got someone to blame.
thx much, man.

#110713 by karim29007 on 10/31 at 10:48 am

zionism and AMERICA.........
What we have witnessed during the CHENEY/BUSH regime is just intensified version of what has been going on since 1948.
The ZIONIST organizations headed by AIPAC are in charge of day to day running of american’s internal and external policies, if one could call it a policy!
Amerian has got ZIONIST PROBLEM.
So long as this problem persists, the Americans are dying in their thousands, a MILLION Iraqis have been murdered with the on going of Palastinians GENOCIDE.
The CANCER of AIPAC must be cured and until then the said regime continue to carry out the wishes of their masters in TEL-AVIV and the killings goes on unabated inconjunction with kidnapping and torturing innocent people and......
When the Congrss is powerless,the regime using the CONSTITUTION AS A TOILET PAPER, then the American people must act directly to stop this madness AND PUT THESE WAR CRIMINALS ON TRIAL.

#110657 by Howard on 10/31 at 7:08 am
(142 comments total)

The Palestinians Could Have A State

Today, the Palestinians could be enjoying their 60th year of independence, or their 52nd, or their 19th, or their 3rd or the eve of their 2nd. That’s right, by my count they have had at least five opportunities to have a state beside Israel if that was their real objective, but they have chosen to hold out for a Palestinian state instead of Israel. They stubbornly cling to their dreams of a Palestinians state replacing Israel rather than accepting the offer to establish a state beside Israel.

The first chance for statehood was in 1947 when the UN actually created an Arab state in Palestine. It was not perfect, it was not what they wanted, but it was a state. The Zionists accepted partition even though it was a truly rotten deal for them too. Think about it. Like the Arabs, the Jews believed they were entitled to all of Palestine, and not just what was then called Palestine, but the 80% of what had been Palestine that the British lopped off and turned into Transjordan. True, the UN gave the Jews more land, but most of it was the Negev desert. The borders were indefensible, and Jerusalem was not only excluded from the Jewish state, it was to be internationalized and surrounded by the Arab state.

So why did the Jews accept such a lousy deal?

David Ben-Gurion and the other Zionist leaders recognized it was the best deal they would get. They also understood that the international community was offering legal recognition for the establishment of a Jewish state. And most important, they would now have an independent state that could be a haven to Jews from around the world, and they could build it into something greater.

Most Palestinian Arabs, on the other hand, believed Palestine really was just southern Syria. They were convinced by their Arab brethren that they had no need to compromise because the Jews would be driven into the sea and they would have the entire country. The whole refugee issue is proof that most Palestinian Arabs were not even prepared to fight for their independence; they chose to flee instead. And so their chance for statehood was squandered.

#110654 by Akira_Maritias on 10/31 at 6:53 am
(480 comments total)

Well, Howard, I guess I’ll respond to you. Some of that post was made in a bit of haste, so I can understand if it confuses you.

“The above is a pretty sad comment.”

Not nearly as sad as dead Palestinian children, but go on.

“What does it mean to “ stand up to Israel”? Look at a map, 20 large Arab lands surround Israel with 100 X the population. Is Israel ganging up on its neighbors again? Especially since Hamas has been sending rockets daily into Israel and has announced often that it wants no peace whatsoever with Israel, just their destruction. So who is killing whom?”

I didn’t once say ‘go Hamas, woo!’. I find Hamas to be a bit out of line (understatement). However, that don’t make Israel innocent and helpless. They’ve been sitting there, urging America to bomb Iran. In addition to that, they’ve been building up an army of their own, as well as enlisting young Jews from America to join up with their troops. They shoved Palestine and took some of their land, and when Palestine tried to reason with Israel, Israel responded by attacking and taking more land. So, Palestine resisted, and Israel attacked them again. You’re picking up history right at the ‘Palestine attacks’ part, whilst ignoring the tension that started this whole mess.

“And what does the comment mean about a “state forged out of ‘religious fuzzy-wuzzies’s” ?”

UN gave Israel to the Jews, on the ground of religious fuzzy-wuzzies, AKA, pity. They felt bad about WWII, so they gift wrapped Israel. Makes Bush really excitable to see the promised land again.

“It was Israel as a nation that was around before and since Roman times.”

Then it wasn’t, and it became Palestine. People live there now.

“Can’t the Israeli peoples return since they have been there for all these past centuries? I think Jewish people would be insulted by your phrase of fuzziness ?”

Yes, they can return. They -cannot- rename it to Israel, nor can they kick the inhabitants out. We stole the land from Native Americans to build America. According to you, it is their right and they should be allowed to violently kick out present day Americans and go back to living in the great plains and whatnot. I have a feeling that you wouldn’t feel so great if you were told to leave your home because of something that happened hundreds of years before your birth. Then again, you probably don’t think about the Native Americans; nope, just the Jewish people who were booted from their land that are now violently taking it back, even though they already had land; they now want more.

“But since the land is a contentious issue at best, that’s why the 2 state solution is the best way out. But that’s been rejected over and over by the Pal’s, who by the way, never mentioned having their own land until 1967, as they considered themselves until that time as arabs from Syria.”

The reason that 2 states won’t work: Israel. They’re taking over the other state, and the average American is quietly rooting for them. Palestinians lived there peacefully until their land was taken by other countries who immediately drew out the lines and called them ‘Palestinian’ while the other side was called ‘Israelites’. Now the Palestinians are being ethnically cleansed from Israel. Sound fair to you?

“And as to the comment that Israel is killing them off that’s such a stretch of nonsense, that I feel sad for the writer who twists reality and history.”

Bullshit. Google is your god damned friend. Of course, you probably spend too much time watching Fox news and CNN to notice what’s happening. Ever been over there? Ever read anything that isn’t being spoon fed to you by a news ticker? There’s plenty of horror stories coming from Palestine, but that would make Israel look bad, and no one with religion in mind could -ever- make Israel look bad.

#110648 by Leefeller on 10/31 at 6:32 am
(467 comments total)

Our Constitution has been under attack for a long time, their are opportunists every where who believe people with rights are nothing but a loose cannon, for they want freedom for them selves and control.

Sometimes I never know which post I am on, this one is about rights stricken from our Constitution.

Congress is manipulated, by acceptance on their part, if one group or lobby has extra undue influence over them, it is their fault not the lobby.

Religion is only one tool used by power brokers to control the ignorant. Looking at the way Congress is going, one would suspect the payoffs are really great, or like Japan before WWII, congress has been pressured by threat to vote as they have?

Like religion I believe all the smoke and mirrors are intended to pull the focus away from the real issues, and the Israel lobby focus is just more of the same. Building hate is another tool used by the smoke and mirrors crowd.

Reason is absent when hate is driving.

#110647 by James on 10/31 at 6:26 am

Du-uh. Why are leftists crying about a police state? That’s all communism has flourished in. You’re just upset that the police are under YOUR thumb!

#110643 by musings on 10/31 at 6:14 am

I respect Mr. Hedges’ experience in the field as a reporter and I also respect his commentary on the growth of a police state on our shores. The hope aroused by the jury system’s seeing through the “macaroni string” of evidence presented against the Holy Land Foundation is somehow not enough for Mr. Hedges, though. He is distrustful of the American people in their ability to smell out falsehoods and he somehow imagines that they will never act fast enough to put down the nascent police state which the Bush administration (and earlier ones) have been forging.

Well, maybe he is right, or maybe not.

These are hard times for the elites who live by the pen. But in my opinion, they are not the only elites that count. A jury member who can turn a phrase like the one about the macaroni means that there are millions like him, and they are not going to shut up. They are not serfs or former serfs. They are rowdy Americans, and they are not going away.

In earlier times, say in Britain, you had to take an oath of allegiance to the sovereign. Our equivalent today is to sign onto the 9/11 explanation which our government put forth: that it WAS an act of terrorism by outsiders, way outsiders, not even half-insiders. The elite of the pen may rearrange the responsibility on it, but there is never any domestic blame. That is why the anthrax story is buried.

The article is signed with the oath of loyalty. I reject it.

#110629 by Howard on 10/31 at 5:32 am
(142 comments total)

RE: 110618
by Akiraa
I’m sick of it. Someone needs to stand up to Israel (for all of you politically correct morons, I am not anti-semitic by saying that, much as how I wouldn’t be racist if I said that we should stop Africans from making blood diamonds) and take them down, once and for all. A state forged out of religious fuzzy-wuzzies will only cause pain and suffering. Those Palestinians have been living there since before the fall of Rome, and is it even -slightly- fair that Israelites get to kill them off now that they have returned? No!
The above is a pretty sad comment. What does it mean to “ stand up to Israel”? Look at a map, 20 large Arab lands surround Israel with 100 X the population. Is Israel ganging up on its neighbors again? Especially since Hamas has been sending rockets daily into Israel and has announced often that it wants no peace whatsoever with Israel, just their destruction. So who is killing whom?

And what does the comment mean about a “state forged out of ‘religious fuzzy-wuzzies’s” ? It was Israel as a nation that was around before and since Roman times. Can’t the Israeli peoples return since they have been there for all these past centuries? I think Jewish people would be insulted by your phrase of fuzziness ?

But since the land is a contentious issue at best, that’s why the 2 state solution is the best way out. But that’s been rejected over and over by the Pal’s, who by the way, never mentioned having their own land until 1967, as they considered themselves until that time as arabs from Syria.

And as to the comment that Israel is killing them off that’s such a stretch of nonsense, that I feel sad for the writer who twists reality and history.

#110618 by Akira_Maritias on 10/31 at 4:09 am
(480 comments total)

I honestly think that Mr. 9/11 truth there goes to each article and pastes two identical posts if he can find the phrase 9/11 in the article. Disgusting.


I am growing increasingly disgusted by Bush and Israel. Those two are a deadly mix, because they want to slaughter civilians under the radar while they slaughter terrorists. Justify it away, bury it, slap a terrorist corpse onto the news, and it’s good as new.

I’m sick of it. Someone needs to stand up to Israel (for all of you politically correct morons, I am not anti-semitic by saying that, much as how I wouldn’t be racist if I said that we should stop Africans from making blood diamonds) and take them down, once and for all. A state forged out of religious fuzzy-wuzzies will only cause pain and suffering. Those Palestinians have been living there since before the fall of Rome, and is it even -slightly- fair that Israelites get to kill them off now that they have returned? No!

#110603 by cyrena on 10/31 at 1:52 am
(1422 comments total)

#110257 by TAO Walker

• It is their chronic fear itself (of still having something to lose) that is really what binds these “civilized individuals”....

Oh Tao, you’ve done it again. This just explains it all, I’ve just never been able to articulate it in such pure and understandable form.

They still think they have something to lose.

Meantime, here’s only a short piece from the “thought crime bill” Maybe they DO still have something to lose. I mean, what if we were to unleash this bill over in Disney World, or down in the rabbit-hole, where they’re all reading their Bibles? I dunno…it could go either way….

To prevent homegrown terrorism, and for other purposes.

AND FOR OTHER PUROSES – There’s the kicker right there. They didn’t even have to write the rest of this stuff. (you’re right Purplewolf, they didn’t read it. They didn’t even read what Cheney’s lawyers wrote up) Anyway, I don’t know why they bothered with the rest of this. What it means is that they’ll do anything they want, to anybody they want, and they won’t give a reason, because they’ve already been doing this for years anyway.

BUT, since this is how they’ve chosen to ‘define’ it…

IDEOLOGICALLY BASED VIOLENCE.—The term ‘ideologically based violence’ means the use, planned use, or threatened use of force or violence by a group or individual to promote the group or individual’s political, religious, or social beliefs.

Does this mean I can “report” all of those people who send me all of that Bible stuff? I call that a use of force to promote the Radical Right Christian Agenda. Will they cart them off to jail? I mean, doesn’t that read as the use of force to promote the group or individual’s political, religious, or social beliefs. Can’t we use this on Bill O’Reilly?

Well, maybe I should at least send them all warnings first. Explaining this bill, and what will likely happen to them, if they send out Biblical and other Religious stuff, or speak it in Church. Oopps. I better tell them to stay away from church as well. Just to be safe.

This might actually work.

I didn’t bother to read all of the versions though. I guess this is from the latest one.

#110600 by cyrena on 10/31 at 1:12 am
(1422 comments total)

#110517 by Howard

Gee Howard, these Gazans have somehow managed, (in your uninformed opinion) to incarcerate themselves, (thousands of men, women and children) starve themselves, torture, rape and brutalize themselves, and it’s taken them all of this time to do it. They even run themselves over with tanks they stole from the IDF too I guess.

Why should that sound ridiculous, even to a moron?

#110599 by cyrena on 10/31 at 12:54 am
(1422 comments total)

• “And no one, not the courts, not the press, not the gutless Democratic opposition, not a compliant and passive citizenry hypnotized by tawdry television spectacles and celebrity gossip, seems capable of stopping the process.”

This might be the most relevant part of the piece, (though I certainly appreciate the entire article, since this stuff has been going on since even before 9/11, generally on the corporate level)

But, I would add to the tactics of hypnosis that Chris didn’t mention…RELIGION. Yep, more so than at any time that I can remember in my life, the politicization of Religion has been used to totally brainwash and otherwise leave large portions of the populace in some ‘never-never land’ of various interpretations of the Bible. And, this is a very noticeable trend, (at least for social scientist and scholars of the Humanities).

Seems to have become like some sort of a drug, only I’ve decided possibly WORSE than the waves of various street drugs. It apparently doesn’t do much harm to the body, the way these other drugs can and have, but it has so thoroughly jacked-up so many MINDS, (apparently the damage is permanent) that it really does trouble me. I mean, how does one ‘rehabilitate’ from that sort of brainwashing?

Bad effect on me too. I used to claim Christianity, in only because that’s what was passed down to me, (in the form of Catholicism). But, after nearly 8 years of being bombarded with Biblical verses, and scriptures, and ads from Christian car dealers, and Christian pawn shops, and Christian bank lenders, and Christian politicians, and Christen mortgage lenders, and Christian grocers, and Christian sheeple in general, I had to hurry up and change my ‘religious affiliation’ to NONE!! I mean…NONE!!!

• “The goal of the Israeli government and the Bush administration—despite the charade of peace negotiations to be held at Annapolis—is to grind defiant Palestinians into the dirt. Israel, which has plunged the Gaza Strip into one of the world’s worst humanitarian crises, has now begun to ban fuel supplies and sever electrical service”

Now on this, the UN has gotten around to issuing the statement that this is clearly illegal for Israel to do. Well gee. Haven’t we been hearing that for about 60 years? And, when has Israel ever cared to be bothered with the legalities or illegalities of the International Laws? I’d have to say NEVER. And, since no person, state, or other body has ever made Israel accountable for these atrocities, it’s kind of difficult to wonder why they even bother going through the motions.

Still, this is an excellent piece, if only people read it, and understand that this isn’t part of that rabbit-hole existence. It’s really serious. And, this news isn’t available in the Bible verses. (Or, maybe it is, except that I don’t think the Bible readers are getting the interpretations quite right). Crimes against Humanity. Where in the Bible do they talk about that? That might be the only way to get the message across.

#110579 by purplewolf on 10/30 at 7:44 pm
(282 comments total)

# 110555 911truthdotorg

Checked out the links.Do these dumbasses even understand what they have agreed to? After looking at all the legalease B.S. talk they couldn’t have a clue.It is time to write what is meant in direct plain straight forward manner, forget all the other nonessential gibberish that these idiots add to make the bills boring and un-understandable to even those who write this crap.They probably write like this knowing that these will never be read,as with most of the things signed into legislation in America today-sight unseen even though they have the paperwork-most do not read it. Like the IRS,who claim that a 7 year old can understand their tax rules when in actually even the people who write the tax rules could not figure out what they wrote,the same applies to the congress critters.Ask them do they actually know what they just agreed to and I bet over 99% haven’t a clue. That’s why we’re screwed.

#110577 by 911truthdotorg on 10/30 at 6:51 pm
(258 comments total)

This explains everything....

Michael Chertoff, our head of Homeland Security has a name that literally means “of the devil” in Russian. Seldom has real life been more Dickensian.

He also has a cousin who wrote the infamous “Popular Mechanics” 9/11 cover story that attempted to debunk all the 9/11 revisionist theories that run counter to the official consensus reality mythos.


#110555 by 911truthdotorg on 10/30 at 5:15 pm
(258 comments total)

As bad as this is, at least we know about it.

Check this out - passed last week by 94% of the House. It is a Thought Crime bill. Read it and weep.

Kucinich voted NO!!



And the traitors who voted FOR this Orwellian nightmare!


#110546 by Ga on 10/30 at 4:30 pm
(99 comments total)

Ooops, Juan Cole’s blog is “Informed Comment”

Oh, and even the Jerusalem Post thinks that “Occasional 15-minute blackouts will not stop the Kassam rocket fire.”

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=11923806950 44&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

#110544 by Ga on 10/30 at 4:24 pm
(99 comments total)

This is from “Informed Consent,” by Juan Cole, http://www.juancole.com/2007/06/situation-in-gaza-i-ha ve-been-traveling.html:

“The Gazan population is being thrown into more misery by an Israeli blockade of electricity, fuel and even food. (Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert says that it will be a humanitarian blockade; if you believe that, I have a bridge over the River Jordan you can purchase inexpensively from me). UNRWA is warning against the blockade. With an unemployment rate of 50% and widespread malnutrition, caused by the ordinary everyday Israeli pressure on Gaza, the territory’s population can’t take much more extra deprivation without an immense human toll being exacted.”

Note that he wrote this Tuesday, June 19, 2007.

From the same article:

“It is to be expected that a lot of comment in the United States on these events will be rife with racist attitudes and polemical dismissals. The Palestinians have long been demonized by the Western media, apparently for not going along quietly with their expulsion from their homes, the large scale theft of their land, and their reduction to an almost slave-like status of statelessness. Palestinians are not intrinsically more violent than anyone else, not essentially less able to administer or govern than anyone else. Few countries have not had civil wars or at least major civil conflicts. The question should be not “Why are Palestinians like that?"-- which is a racist question-- but what social and economic factors are driving the present conflict?

“Why is it that so little analysis is offered of why things have developed as they have? Isn’t anyone interested in the important differences between Gaza’s economy and that of the West Bank? Gaza is much poorer and much more isolated from the world. Is it any big surprise that its population is more radicalized and might be drawn into supporting Hamas?”


Saying, “Its been accomplished by the inhabitants of the strip over a long time,” is akin to saying to the victim of a robbery, “Don’t make me kill you!”

#110520 by Dr. Knowitall, PhD, PhD on 10/30 at 2:30 pm
(195 comments total)

What people really fear, it seems to me, is their own perceived inability to stop the demagogues, so they either trivialize them or ignore them altogether, hoping they’ll go away. Demagougery is pervasive in America. The 2008 election will bring even more of it on. Get ready.

#110517 by Howard on 10/30 at 2:04 pm
(142 comments total)

The following comes from the above article written by Chris Hedges:
“The goal of the Israeli government and the Bush administration—despite the charade of peace negotiations to be held at Annapolis—is to grind defiant Palestinians into the dirt. Israel, which has plunged the Gaza Strip into one of the world’s worst humanitarian crises, has now begun to ban fuel supplies and sever electrical service. The severe deprivation, the Israelis hope, will see the overthrow of the Hamas government in Gaza and the reinstatement of Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, who has become the Marshal Pétain of the Palestinian people. “
Israel did not plunge the Gaza Strip into a crisis. Its been accomplished by the inhabitants of the strip over a long time. And now that they will not stop shooting their rockets daily into Israel which sooner or later will land in a school bldg full of kids, why should Israel not begin to stop fuel and electricity delivry?
Just maybe it will cause Hamas to stop the rockets?

#110465 by Verne Arnold on 10/30 at 8:04 am
(355 comments total)

#110460 by Leefeller on 10/30 at 7:22 am
(462 comments total)

#110456 by Douglas Chalmers on 10/30 at 6:52 am
(1004 comments total)

Thanks guys, I just get a bit grumpy when important articles (subjects) go off the radar so quickly. This is particularly close to my heart because of my personal involvement. My workers were the best…and then I see pregnant women exposed on a daily basis to dangerous solvents and chemicals. I take them off the “line” and the next day they are placed back in the same job. Over and over again…….

Crap!!! There is no justice…….

#110460 by Leefeller on 10/30 at 7:22 am
(467 comments total)


Compassion seems to be present in many posters in TD. Neoconservatives will have nothing to to with feelings for others.

Vern, your direct involvement with the abuses you see going on in an uncontrolled world, where the buck guides greed, is despised by most of us. It seems our wold has not evolved, opportunists are the same and in some cases the players are the same.

From the killing in Iraq to abuses of workers in a factory, people are the chaff that feeds the mill. It bothers me too, but really do not know what to do, intimidation by even our government seems to be gearing up, as you mentioned in the Orient it is more prevalent were rights are accorded to money.

Liberty for all seems to be an illusion, a carrot on a stick, wealth and power will usually have their way, opinion from a common man.

#110459 by Ed on 10/30 at 7:06 am

By all appearances the government seems to be the natural enemy of the constitution; they’re always looking for loopholes. It’s ironic how public officials take an oath to protect and defend the constitution but effectively violate the oath perpetually.

Of the Bill of Rights, the fourth, fifth and tenth amendments are essentially moot. The sixth and eighth amendments apply only to the wealthy and powerful. And it seems the courts are still having trouble defining the first three words, “we the people.”

Police state indeed. It’s been that way for a long time. Uncle Sam needs you but he doesn’t give a damn about your rights.

#110456 by Douglas Chalmers on 10/30 at 6:52 am
(1019 comments total)

#110452 by Verne Arnold on 10/30 at 6:18 am: “...You’ll have to excuse me, but...”

The article is still in “Ear to the Ground” (see the bar at the top of page - the link is http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/20071029_c redibility_gap/

Don’t forget to click “Notify you when others comment on this article” at the bottom. I know its a problem because the section in your account membership (Your Control Panel -> View Subscriptions) isn’t in any kind of order and searching the site for your own postings doesn’t seem to work either, uhh.

#110452 by Verne Arnold on 10/30 at 6:18 am
(355 comments total)

You’ll have to excuse me, but, BIG BUT, the article about abusive corporate behavior has slid down the slippery slope of popularity and is now below the horizon. American corporate abuse of Asian labor is a serious issue, but it was on the page for one day!!!! This is crap and this site is more interested in the grist mill than serious issues. I have posted serious issues that I have been personally involved in and the “Gap” article was good for two days…bullshit I say…this is 2007 and this problem is alive and well in Asia…I know first hand. So what the hell do you all in America really value? You talk the talk, but do not walk the walk….You all are doomed to your private hells…you just don’t really get do you?

This is all connected.............hello?

#110445 by Mr. Sifter on 10/30 at 5:29 am

This relates to a topic on my blog yesterday, about fearing fear. Check out my website http://www.standingbeforethefire.com

#110409 by republicanSScareme on 10/30 at 1:00 am

I find it hard to accept the idea that our country is turning into a police state, but the facts are pointing strongly to that conclusion.

George Bush is so stupid and arrogant that he joked about being a dictator. Only it wasn’t a joke.

Bush and his henchmen have tried to destroy our country as we know it. That fact is obscured by people talking about this takeover in terms of the constitution.

Blackwater, a private Army accountable to no one but George Bush, with immunity from war crimes, is a better symbol of the danger our country is in than erudite arguments about a unitary executive or habeus corpus.

Hired thugs is the best way to think of these people, not as “mercenaries.” This private Army, trained to kill like crazed SS Waffin Black Shirts, will return from Iraq and go to work for the Bush+ Criminal Syndicate here in the United States.

Let’s hope Bush, Cheney and Gang really leave office without starting a war in Iran or creating a fake terrorist attack in the United States to create martial law which is really what these thugs want.

Pray for the day they leave office.

#110401 by MH76 on 10/30 at 12:10 am
(1 comments total)

I agree with the author’s take on the current state America. It is already a fascist state. The latest evidence is the bill H.R. 1955 passed last week. It is designed to label anyone who disagree with the government’s increasing fascist tendencies a terrorist and subject him to arrest, torture and being disappeared.

Read about it here:

Fascism is HERE! NOW! Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007

#110361 by Leefeller on 10/29 at 6:51 pm
(467 comments total)

Ok folks, lobbies represent special interest who seem to have undue influence on our government, always pushing their personal paid agendas. If any lobby seems to have more influence than the others it means they are more successful.

Lobbies should be outlawed, but congress has watered it down so lobbyists still run the halls of congress like rats at a Republican Convention. Blame Congress not the lobbyists.

Hate mongers undue focus on one lobby is nothing but traditional good old boy bigotry.

#110358 by Ess on 10/29 at 6:38 pm

To Lee (comment #110305):

I don’t know weather either. I do know that education, like the weather, can really change one’s perspective. Good luck.

#110341 by weather on 10/29 at 5:21 pm
(194 comments total)

Welcome to Israel

A political state by day, a religious state for tax purposes, an extradition-free refuge for its citzens who commit crimes elsewhere, but always, the exhausting, manipulating and misunderstood victim that demands to be treated as the exception and always at the expense of others.

#110340 by FrostedFlakes on 10/29 at 5:19 pm

In regards to comment #110305:
Lee, or whatever the hell your name is, if you believe and buy into that load of shit I have a rotten “shrub” here in D.C. that you can bury your head under while you dream.

#110332 by Howard on 10/29 at 4:44 pm
(142 comments total)

RE: 110305
by LEE

WELL DONE, LEE. Ratonal and to the point ! Loved the writing in the Spanish newspaper, also.

#110320 by thomas billis on 10/29 at 3:56 pm

Well in our march to destroy the Constitution we have gotten to show trials.Unfortunately some of the jurors in these cases do not know their part in the show trials.Remember the article refers to a trial in Dallas.Usually in Dallas the state just has to show up to give out the death penalty.The point I think many are missing is the culprits for 911 are out there making videos and we have been reduced to show trials.It is like your wife is giving you a hard time and you go next door and smack you neighbors wife.The terrorists have not attacked us since 911 not because this incompetent administration has done a thing to make us safer we are doing their job on ourselves.

#110318 by Drea on 10/29 at 3:50 pm

Paul, I second that motion.

Lee, you would do well to meditate on the “prejudice and ignorance” you accuse Chris Hedges of, and apply it to the racist piece of filth you just posted.

#110315 by jbart on 10/29 at 3:42 pm

To all Bloggers found here,
When you all weed through all the B.S. of right and wrong, consider this “simple” observation. A country without laws is not a country, at least not an organized, well running, one. It’s anarchy, folks !! If the “law” dictates a disposition, it MUST be accepted by the populace it governs. A “true” democracy holds that differing opinions and philosophies are only “allowable” if they fall within the boundaries set by the “authorized” laws that govern. In all the cases in this article, that basic truth exists. We don’t need to agree, if it meets the requirements, but need to accept it to be part of the laws we use to govern our lives. Nuff said.
Bush, his Dad, Grandad, Mother, kids, blood relatives (including brothers & sisters) and “my main man” Cheney (and his) need to be punished for “crimes against America”.
Crimes against humanity comes in second, in my humble opinion. I added this to ensure that you all understand where I stand on this despicable situation that we’ve (seemed) to vote ourselves into. Bunch of effin idiots we are. Peace.

#110311 by Drea on 10/29 at 3:34 pm

Gee Lee, last time I checked “a lot of disturbing implications and associations” wasn’t enough to charge someone as guilty—our legal system, after all, is founded upon the doctrine of “innocent until proven guilty.”

But as long as we’re prosecuting organizations for funding terrorists, why don’t we work on prosecuting the U.S. government for outsourcing our terrorist activities to Blackwater and the other abhorable contractors that are killing innocent Iraqi citizens every day?

#110310 by Paul Fretheim on 10/29 at 3:24 pm
(10 comments total)

Lee’s comment and the attached poem are rascist and unacceptable and I hope will soon be removed.

#110305 by Lee on 10/29 at 3:01 pm

I don’t know weather people would rather live in Israel ... or, weather they would rather live in the countries surrounding Israel. Hmmm, the honorable countries surrounding Israel ... where the leadership lives in opulence, while their people live in squaler ... where young girls are stoned to death ... where heads and hands are cut off ... where there are very little personal freedoms, including religion and the freedom of speech ... where most of Truthdig’s commentators would be silenced, or severly punished, or worse, for expressing their divergent views ... where most of the world’s terrorism (including 911) comes from ... where madrassas are brain washing children into becoming suicide bombers ... where journalists in Sweden, Denmark and elsewhere are threated with death for drawing cartoons ... In fact, here’s an article written by a Spanish Journalist ...
The following is a copy of an article written by Spanish writer Sebastian Vilar Rodrigez and published in a Spanish newspaper on 5-22-07. It doesn’t take much imagination to extrapolate the message to the rest of Europe - and possibly to the rest of the world.

Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 14:30:20 -0500

By Sebastian Vilar Rodrigez(*)

I walked down the street in Barcelona, and suddenly discovered a terrible truth - Europe died in Auschwitz . We killed six million Jews and replaced them with 20 million Muslims. In Auschwitz we burned a culture, thought, creativity, talent. We destroyed the chosen people, truly chosen, because they produced great and wonderful people who changed the world.

The contribution of this people is felt in all areas of life: science, art, international trade, and above all, as the conscience of the world. These are the people we burned.

And under the pretense of tolerance, and because we wanted to prove to ourselves that we were cured of the disease of racism, we opened our gates to 20 million Muslims, who brought us stupidity and ignorance, religious extremism and lack of tolerance, crime and poverty, due to an unwillingness to work and support their families with pride.

They have blown up our trains and turned our beautiful Spanish cities into the third world, drowning in filth and crime.

Shut up in the apartments they receive free from the government, they plan the murder and destruction of their naive hosts.

And thus, in our misery, we have exchanged culture for fanatical hatred, creative skill for destructive skill, intelligence for backwardness and superstition.

We have exchanged the pursuit of peace of the Jews of Europe and their talent for hoping for a better future for their children, their determined clinging to life because life is holy, for those who pursue death, for people consumed by the desire for death for themselves and others, for our children and theirs.

What a terrible mistake was made by miserable Europe.

#110297 by FrostedFlakes on 10/29 at 1:56 pm

Doug Chalmers and Tao Walker, you guys are alright with me. Just as you both have so eloquenty worded, just because they practice the production of fear does not mean that you need be afraid. If the American populace were to suddenly awaken and take personal responsibility for allowing these criminals activities to occur, the fear itself would dissipate because of the need of accountability. No matter what they have destroyed of this great country so far, we as a people can still recapture and restore America’s legacy by our own actions (as opposed to our own collective inaction for the last seven years). Be not afraid!! Be diligent and determined until all who have failed this country can be found and tried for their atrocities, which are many. And let us not forget that even though we may be the mightiest nation in the world, that there is a world and we are a nation of it. Might and wealth does not equate to greatness, but peace and humanity does.

#110293 by weather on 10/29 at 1:31 pm
(194 comments total)

Lee, you love Israel, move there and fix it!

Here’s a country on the World’s stage w/WMD, its manipulating and selfish hands all over our wallet - and the emotional development of a very sneaky and snotty little brat that has No friends and no thought to ask why?
Israel could have easily dovetailed its standing on that stage as an honorable and esteemable player. Instead its a Global disgrace - good job and just think they’ve no one to thank but themselves.

#110288 by Lee on 10/29 at 12:59 pm

The name of this site is Truthdig ... not Partial Truth Dig ... not ... Just The Truths I Want You To Hear, that support MY political agenda dig. Although there was a mistrial ... there are a lot of disturbing implications and associations surrounding Holy Land Foundation, So Hedges shouldn’t gloat too much. Check out em out at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Land_Foundation_for_ Relief_and_Development

#110284 by JCR1955 on 10/29 at 12:32 pm

To Non Credo,
Your comment of sleepwalking Americans is dead on. So many people that I come in contact with have no idea that their constitution rights and freedoms are in jeopardy. Their concerns are focused on paying the bills and what to do on the weekend. If I bring up the fact that their rights are being eroded by the Patriot Act, they either call me unpatriotic or think when the war is over, all will go bad to “normal”.
They are doing just as Bush told them to when the Iraq War began, “They’ve gone to Disney World”.

#110282 by rodney on 10/29 at 12:01 pm

You can’t have both a constitution and a patriot act. Seems to contradict each ogher. Who gets protection under the constitution and who gets screwed under the patriot act and even more important who gets to decide? It’s time we get back to the principles on which our nation was founded. The U S constitution. That way we can put the Decider back where he belongs and have three branches of government again.

#110261 by bill volk on 10/29 at 8:53 am

I think I like this case because, although it may be an anomaly, it did demonstrate that rule of law is still alive. I must agree with earlier comment that this case was a fluke. Most folks don’t see the erosion of personal/constitutional liberties as a concern to their own lives and many seen to welcome the face valid claims of the feds that all of this is for their own “safety”. I have done some psych consulting to various law enforcement agencies and am seeing an unstated “us against them” view held by many in that profession. lainly stated, the presuption of guilt based upon the feds say-so seems the norm.

#110257 by TAO Walker on 10/29 at 8:36 am
(145 comments total)

Chris Hedges still seems to believe he has something left to lose here. So do many others who continue to fall-for the scare tactics of our tormentors and their stupid human TrickyDicks. It is their chronic fear itself (of still having something to lose) that is really what binds these “civilized individuals”....NOT the metasticizing police-state apparatus, no matter how sophisticated its technology or ruthless its wielders’ intentions.

What our wannabe owner/overseers themselves half-live in constant unholy terror of, is that their masses of subject/citizens will suddenly see-through their pyramid-scheme/confidence-game’s absolutely hollow “threats,” remember themselves as free wild natural Human Beings, and simply walk away from the puppet-show which Douglas Chalmers (#110216) correctly points out has corralled their bodies and souls by capturing their attention and imaginations. In fact, the global gangbangers themselves already know f’r sure their “show/business” charade has about run its dead-end course. Their only aim now is to keep enough of “the people” fooled long enough to engineer some kind of escape-mechanism....from the inevitable consequences of their own damned folly.

So they’ve used their age-old (and about worn-out and used-up) collection of “deceptive practices” in a last-ditch effort to ratchet-up their rule-of-fear into one more outright reign-of-terror, hoping desperately to keep enough of us cowed and under-the-spell to somehow slip-away from the scene of their cosmic crime at least un-caught in-the-act, if not (this time) altogether free of suspicion. Theirs is, however, an already lost “ca(u)se.” This time there are living witnesses to the whole bloody privateering enterprise. This time the intended victims of their terracide saw them coming. This time they’re NOT getting-away-with-it....and there’s no place left for them to go and hide, anyway, even if they tried.

So Chris Hedges and others still caught in the collapsing contraption, especially those who are self-confessed of the Xtian persuasion, as he is, can feel free to finally just take “YES!” for The Answer, and “BE NOT AFRAID!” At the very least they could have the decency to quit doing the fear-mongers’ dirty-work for ‘em by trying to scare hell outta the rest of us.

Right now might be the perfect time to recover the courage of what so many claim to be their true convictions....to start walking their talk....to start living their beliefs.


#110244 by Non Credo on 10/29 at 7:46 am
(433 comments total)

It’s simple. The neocons:

(1) declare the country in a state of permanent war;

(2) declare that anyone who “aids the enemy” is subject to being treated as an enemy on the battlefield, not worthy of any normal legal protections; and then

(3) give the Dear Leader (and his minions) complete discretion to define “aiding the enemy” to include anything that “gives heart” to our “enemies” - which can easily include something like feeding a Palestinian child.

This case is a fluke. The general, unstoppable trend is toward a shutting down of our liberties, unless the neocons are stopped very soon by an extraordinary uprising of the sleepwalking American people - something that is nearly impossible to imagine.

#110242 by Lee on 10/29 at 7:41 am

Even though there is one true voice, like Howard, in this list of commentators, he like the sane loners who are standing up to the government in vain, is standing up to the perennial prejudice and ignorance of those like Hedges and weather, who always have to blame Israel for everything. It doesn’t matter whether Palestinian rockets are constantly being lobed into the Israeli public areas, or whether suicide bombers are blowing up Israeli women and children ... Castigate Israel for stopping fuel supplies as a way to stop the rockets. Ya know, Hedges, you have a valid argument against the U.S. government, and your desire to preserve due process ... but, like always your extremist politics which are an equally radical counterpart to the neocons, distorts your valid points, enabling you to attract minimal support, from your own venue, your knee jerk groupie, like weather, with a one way agenda, . I also notice your charade at fairness, when your articles always favor groups like the Palestinians and, of all things Hamas, an obvious terrorist organization, over Israel. This practice calls into question your credibility as a reliable journalist.

#110240 by weather on 10/29 at 7:35 am
(194 comments total)

Howard what’s the difference between Israel and Iran?

Iran can steal from you and so can Israel, but Israel will help you look for it.

Israel’s arrogance is only exceeded by their remakable capacity for deceit. While this is a part of their dark pathology, its infected us now too. Still stuck in the puckballs of denial? Just look around - you must be proud.

#110234 by Douglas Chalmers on 10/29 at 6:52 am
(1019 comments total)

#110223 by Leefeller on 10/29 at 6:07 am: “How does that compare to Plato’s Cave except maybe the audience did not have a choice...?”

In Indonesia, the “audience” has knowledge of truth and lies, even though it is a police state (once a military dictatorship) and an Islamic republic.

In the USA, a supposed democracy, the “audience” live in ignorance and fear. They are chained by their illusions - and delusions.

The solution - stop living metaphors and illusory allegories of Truth and Freedom and start living in the REAL WORLD!

This is not “dialectic reasoning” so much as open-minded diligence in accepting oneself (and the USA) as part of a greater whole and not the centre of the universe.

#110233 by OLIVE GROVE BOOKS on 10/29 at 6:42 am

Publisher’s Note: Our author had it right back in 1987 but nobody would publish him until we did in 2004 1/2.
SAN FRANCISCO – THE PALESTINE CONSPIRACY, a genre spy-thriller by Robert Spirko, is now in its second printing and was fourth on the best-seller list at Atlasbooks, Inc., a national book distributor.

Spirko, a financial and geo-political analyst who has given his advice to the National Security Council, turned his attention to the Middle East in 1987, after discovering several common elements related to the Middle East question. He wrote down his analysis, and when he was finished, he not only had a solution to the quagmire, he had a story to tell. THE PALESTINE CONSPIRACY foreshadowed the Persian Gulf War by three years, and the resultant Iraq War followed by the Sept. 11 attack.

Spirko states, “The chief threat in the region I see right now is the threat to Saudi Arabia by Iran and Al Qaeda. If Al Qaeda were to overthrow the present royal family in Saudi Arabia, cutting off the oil supply to western nations including Japan and China, it would bring down entire world economies. France and Germany would be begging us to go to war to retake those oil wells. It would be World War III.”
“If such a scenario were to occur,” he reiterates, “France and the European economies would collapse in a matter of weeks.”

“Another looming concern is Iran which wants to develop nuclear weapons to couple with their Shahab 4, 5 & 6 missiles on the drawing boards which have a range to hit London, Israel, all of Europe, southern Russia and the United States. Also, the Iranian government has said it initially had 300 centrifuges to enrich uranium to weapons grade material. They have increased that to 3,000. They will soon increase that again to 10,000 centrifuges,” Spirko says. “They have the additional capacity to add another 20,000 centrifuges in mass production techniques that will enable them to produce at least seven nuclear bombs in about a year. Where did they get these centrifuges?” Spirko answers that question by stating an Arab proverb, “The enemy of my enemy is my friend.”

“Simply put,” Spirko explains, “they probably got them from Saddam Hussein before the Iraq War started and were probably smuggled out of Iraq and into Iran just like he did his air force of 600 Soviet fighter planes. In other words, he gave them to his former enemy rather than let them be destroyed on the ground.”

“Why would he have done any differently with the 30,000 centrifuges he supposedly had on a decentralized basis inside Iraq before the war?” Spirko asks. “Isn’t it strange that Iran could come up with a nuclear weapons program in about six months to a year when it took the United States six years under the Manhattan Project with 5,000 of the world’s most brilliant scientists like Robert Oppenheimer, Niels Bohr, Seaborg, Einstein, Fermi, and others working on it?”

Another point Spirko makes on the Mideast is that, “It is time for the Israelis and Palestinians to return to the Camp David Peace Talks or some other place, resume where they left off and “freeze in place” the already-agreed-upon negotiating points,” Spirko says.

“And, it’s all related to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict which I said back in 1987 was the crux of my book. It always has been, and always will be until it’s settled,” Spirko says. “That linkage is exactly what Osama Bin Laden stated in a taped message aired the weekend before the election in November of 2004. Whether you believe him or not is beside the point. That’s what’s he told us, and we’d better take that into account.”

The novel is a mass market paperback produced by Olive Grove Publishers. THE PALESTINE CONSPIRACY can be ordered on the web at http://www.atlasbooks.com, or email orders from: order@bookmasters.com, or from Barnes & Nobles, Border’s, Dalton’s, efollett.com & Follett bookstores at colleges and universities, WaldenBooks, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, Target.com and bookstores.

#110223 by Leefeller on 10/29 at 6:07 am
(467 comments total)

How does that compare to Plato’s Cave except maybe the audience did not have a choice?

#110218 by Conservative Yankee on 10/29 at 5:54 am

Funny how perspective differs. See, I feel The US colony has always been a “police state” Is it getting worse? more confining? sure, but it would have done that without GWB, Cheney and the other current goons.

Several years ago I met some East German youths who lived under the Rudi Mittig’s Stasi. In our press it appeared that this East German police force was the height of repressive totalitarianism BUT my young friends saw no difference between the way US police talked to people, and the way their native police talked to them.

You think the police State is a new development? talk to anyone who protested the 68 Democratic convention, was at Greensboro, or happened to be black, in the 60’s.

We are a police state, But have been at least through my life. AND in reading about the Pinkertons, the Wells Fargo folks, Abe Lincoln’s treatment of “citizens” and the way the railroads treated people who happened to be in their proposed right-of-ways, my guess is we always have been

#110216 by Douglas Chalmers on 10/29 at 5:46 am
(1019 comments total)

In Indonesia, this would all be described as a “Wayang” - a show of puppets moved behind a backlit silk screen or on a fake stage to tease and deceive and entertain the audience. http://www.indo.com/culture/wayang.html That is also they term to describe how politics is played to deceive.....

#110215 by Leefeller on 10/29 at 5:45 am
(467 comments total)

The Rule of Law has become a rule of the common man. This whole attack on the supporters of different middle eastern groups, reminds me of the Japanese internment camps. Not a Moslem’s fan or of any religion, I still believe in the limp Constitution and the need to regain our liberties. Watching our rights go down the drain with the support of Congress is sicking.

History shows us that the same thing happened in Japan and Germany before world war II. Tojo and Hitler eliminated freedoms and rights by using deception and lies, plus intimidation.

Weather, religion is part of the problem not just Islam, simple attacks on one segment of the world smacks of ignorance. Blame is easy, facts and truth are much harder to find, especially when you have a media and government working together in deception.

#110213 by Verne Arnold on 10/29 at 5:31 am
(355 comments total)

Get the goddamned “Galoots” out of our government no matter who they are, before it’s too late...this is your last warning, y’all hear now?

#110209 by Howard on 10/29 at 5:07 am
(142 comments total)

Blame Israel for anything or any movement or militancy in any religion or any gov’t or political party’s goals. Little Israel, not even the size of Rhode Island. Population the smallest in the Middle East. Are they ganging up on their 20 neighbors again? Ah well, they’re still a good excuse. Couldn’t be any other country. Gotta’ be them.
What’s the diff if Israel has nothing to do with this article. Make sure to get to all the other articles on this site and blame Israel.
You is battin’ a 100% with your fixation. Don’t stop now.

#110208 by weather on 10/29 at 4:53 am
(194 comments total)

Before Israel, Islam was of little concern to America.

#110206 by Tom Joad on 10/29 at 4:40 am

Just read on Saturday that Israel is also banning anasthetics to Palestine. That means hospitals have to cancel operations, etc.

#110203 by Bert on 10/29 at 3:52 am

I don’t agree entirely, I think when you start talking religious charity, doesn’t matter what denomination or sect of what religion, what you’ve got is a cash vehicle, ostensibly upstanding and proper and pious and whatnot, but more often than once we’ve seen glaring examples of all kinds of abuse, all in the name of some variant of God, of course, but shady business and sanctified funny money just the same. JUST yesterday there was a story about some guy based in the phils but living and preaching in the USA funneling money back to the philippines from his religious activity. Don’t assume that you’re not being ripped off just because someone says they’re doing something for a charity or a church or whatever. I care not, christian/muslim/jewish/_________name here, while you’re busy on bended knee, keep an eye on the door and a hand on your wallet, there…

Kindly Forwarded By Sukru Server Aya


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