467) Watching "Jihad Watch"

Jihadwatch.org is one of the many sites that have taken the intensified animosity toward Muslims in the West, as a result of Islamic terrorism, and have used the opportunity to reinforce the age-old image of Muslims in the West... that of subhuman religious fanatics who won't rest until the entire world is enslaved under their brand of Taliban-style totalitarianism. . . .
The end result: such sites advocate hatred. They are usually run by Christian (and sometimes Jewish) fundamentalists, no differently than the hate sites run by Islamic fundamentalists. But the West isn't going to listen to the sites run by the nutty Islamic fundamentalists; because it is now more openly permissible to regard Muslims as the "enemy," however, neutral Westerners who aren't going to take the trouble to examine the ins and outs are highly susceptible to be taken in by the tricky tactics of the zealous Christian fundamentalists.

These sites are like anathema to me, as if it's not difficult enough to go through the hate sites of the Armenian and Genocide Scholar "fundamentalists." The only reason why I decided to focus on Jihad Watch is because while preparing a page on Tessa Hofmann, I noticed Jihadwatch.org gleefully printed a claim from a biased Zionist source that the Ottoman Empire massacred Jews. (As the unwarranted claim supplemented the article Jihadwatch had posted; Turkey is pedominantly Muslim, therefore, Turkey is evil.) In the same week, Vahakn Dadrian used this hate site to exclusively post his latest ramblings, in response to an article by Guenter Lewy. I wanted to examine Prosecutor Dadrian's latest sneak attack tactics, and I felt a closer look to Jihad Watch would be warranted. (Of course, Jihadwatch.org is but one of many hate sites; however, an explanation as to why I singled Jihadwatch.org out was called for.)


Robert Spencer

Robert Spencer is the force behind the site. He claims: "I am not a Christian fundamentalist" (in Frontpage.com, a July 22, 2004 article entitled "Jesus' Jihad?"). I wonder how many people would agree.

The site tells us:

"Why Jihad Watch? Because the West is facing a concerted effort by Islamic jihadists, the motives and goals of whom are largely ignored by the Western media, to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world."

So here we go. I don't know where he is getting the idea that the Western media is "covering up" the motives and goals of Islamic terrorists, because whenever there is an article about Islam, it's certainly not going to sing the praises of the religion. Furthermore, note the implication that the Muslim world is actually powerful enough to destroy the West and to make the world Islamic


If anything, Western culture is prevalent with the
message that Muslims = Terrorists, as seen here with
the wonderfully satiric 2004 movie, TEAM AMERICA.

To my understanding, "nations" that chose Muslim as a religion throughout history did so on their own accord, mainly through word-of-mouth (despite all the "forced conversion" propaganda from Armenians and others; in the Ottoman Empire's history, the only forced exception was the Janissaries.) The major religion running an actual program to go off to the far corners of the earth in an attempt to alter the beliefs of others happened to be Christianity, through their missionary agents. That's why we have Japanese nuns and a church on practically every corner in Hawaii.

I believe "Jihad" is a word that has a different context in Arabic, where violence is far from the essential idea; but it has come to mean a holy war against Christian infidels in the West. This is the meaning the host of the site, Robert Spencer, chooses to emphasize:

Jihad (in Arabic, "struggle") is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur'an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits. No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.

Even though Robert Spencer acknowledges that there are moderate Muslims, the idea he wants to put across is that every Muslim is a potential killer for the Islamic cause. Forget about Islam having been known historically to be based on tolerance. (Christians and Jews lived freely in the Ottoman Empire, for example, when Muslims and Jews were barely regarded as human beings in Christian European nations. Europe became a power bloc mostly after the Crusaders returned from their holy wars, having been civilized through their encounters in the East.) Robert Spencer is going to make it seem like the subhuman Muslims have no respect for human rights and dignity.


Here's what it boils down to: of course if we selectively present examples from fundamentalists, like the Wahhabis from Saudi Arabia, it's going to look bad. To provide a parallel, there was a recent PBS show on Lubbock, Texas, where a girl who was raised under a typically conservative household was rebelling against the dumb religious notions that her town had been taken over by. These vocal extremists had taken over the school boards, for example, and their idea of sex education is to teach abstinence. Incidents of venereal disease among the teenagers have been skyrocketing, as a result.

I certainly am not going to defend the similarly kooky religious notions nations like Saudi Arabia live under. I don't claim to be an expert on Saudi Arabia, but having seen some documentaries, I'm aware most Saudis... despite the excesses of their laws... have it pretty good. We in the West have no right to expect that every society ought to conform to our Western ways.

It's not that these comparatively weak Muslim nations want to "make the world Islamic," an idea Robert Spencer tries to frighten us with (although certainly the extremist Muslim believers would love nothing better, just like extremist Christian believers would love to impose Christian fundamentalism on the entire world); if anybody is forcing the world to convert to its ways, it's the West. (Note how they have succeeded.) The irony, of course, is that the examples of Islamic extremism is a REACTION to the bullying ways of the West. So when these forces don't roll over and accept Western domination, then the West is going to say, Hey. What's the matter with these people? Oh, of course... all they know is violence, and "jihad." (Easier to believe, since each side has a bad rap to the other since the Crusades.)

Those versed in the truth of the Armenian "Genocide" know fully well there are two sides to every story. I'm not going to get mired in these ridiculous religious discussions (is there anything more stupid than arguing, "My religion is better than yours"?), and I only conducted minimal research; I'm going to use as an example the one site I came across as a counterpoint. From http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac5.htm#links:

"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors. (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things). (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"

"If thou dost stretch thy hand against me, to slay me, it is not for me to stretch my hand against thee to slay thee: for I do fear God, the cherisher of the worlds. (The Noble Quran, 5:28)"

"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (The Noble Quran, 60:8)"

There's a whole slew of these quotations from the Koran. Sure there are medieval quotes of violence and other nonsense, just as in the Bible. But those such as Robert Spencer are mainly going to emphasize the horrible parts... because Robert Spencer's agenda is to make you hate Islam even more.

I'll refer to this "counter-point" site ("answering-christianity.com") as a quick and easy way to supplement the points I'm making... but that does not mean I'm condoning this site either. I perused it only very quickly, and since it's written by a believer (but written fairly well, in a light-hearted way at times; these kinds of sites are needed to counter the hatred spread by sites such as jihadwatch.org) there are areas that make me bristle. For example, on a page examining treatment of women, we have a photo of a pure, innocent, covered up Muslim girl; and on the right side, we have sexy images of women typically seen in Western ads. While a thought-provoking point is made that the Western women are presented as sex objects, these women are labeled as... "Satanic"? if those women represent Satan, show me the way to Old Scratch.

Let's take a look at how Robert Spencer chooses to make his points; this is from "Islam 'will never support terror or violence'":

Dubai: The Islamic Personality of the year 2005 said Islam has never and will never be a religion of terror or violence because it preserves the individual's human rights and dignity.

Shaikh presents the Islamic Personality of the Year award during the closing ceremony of the Dubai International Holy Quran Award.

"The message of Islam and Muslims is modesty, fairness, security, stability, sympathy, harmony and kindness," said Dr Shaikh Abdul Rahman Al Sudais, the veteran Quran reader and imam of the Holy Mosque in Makkah.

Whew, that's a relief! I feel better already! Oh, and here's some modesty, fairness, security, stability, sympathy, harmony and kindness from Al-Sudais, via a January 2004 WND story, "WND goes inside 'mainstream' Muslim conference":

Last April, while addressing 2 million followers at the Grand Mosque in Mecca, chief cleric Sheikh Abdul Rahman al-Sudais prayed to God to "terminate" the Jews, who he called "the scum of humanity, the rats of the world, prophet killers ... pigs and monkeys."

Al-Sudais also urged Arabs and Muslims to abandon peace initiatives with Israel. His comments were carried worldwide by Reuters and the Associated Press. The racist characterization of Jews was not a singular occurrence, as suggested by some media. Al-Sudais has variously described Jews as "evil," a "continuum of deceit," "tyrannical" and "treacherous."


Uh-oh. Looks like a certain two-faced imam was caught with his pants down. (Assuming his words were correctly transcribed by "WND," which seems to have had an agenda of his own; "World News Daily" appears to be just one more of the omnipresent right-wing Christian sites.)

Now what does this presentation say about Robert Spencer?

He's taking one disgusting sermon by a religious zealot ... and of course, he's not the only religious zealot, as Spencer tells us these hateful words were not a singular occurrence... and trying to apply it across the board to the entire religion.

Horribly irresponsible. Simply horrible.

It's as if one perused broadcasts of "The 700 Club," broadcasts that similarly reach viewers in the millions in the USA, and selectively presented the hateful words that are used against Muslims, homosexuals, secular humanists, and what-have-you. (Evangelists are careful against coming across as anti-Semitic, given the extent of Jewish political power in the United States... but don't think they would not joyfully criticize the "Christ-killers," given half a chance! Once in a while, they do slip up, though...as has the Rev. Jerry Falwell.)

Now I know most Christians would not think in the wildly extremist ways of their fundamentalists. Wouldn't that be terribly irresponsible to make it seem as they do?

I'm sure most "real" Muslims would not condone the prejudice, as reported by the WND, of this Shaikh Abdul Rahman al-Sudais. Naturally, the like-thinking ones who flock to see him are going to soak it up. And, naturally, we in the West are going to readily believe all Muslims are composed of such mindless drones... because Muslims are all a little "less-than-human," and are prone to fanaticism.

Now what is really behind this cleric's racist rant? Does anyone believe his counterpart from a few centuries back would have lashed out at the Jews... when the Jews were powerless, and Muslims and Jews feel more of a kinship between their religions than they do with Christianity (for example, Jesus is recognized only as a prophet, and then there is that "pig" aversion). This is the resulting human prejudice stemming from what is seen as the injustices practiced by Israel, and her main benefactor, the United States. Of course, it takes a big man, like Mahatma Gandhi or Martin Luther King, not to go in the direction of hatred when you or your kind are being "persecuted"... but how easily do we find the big men? Most men are going to go the way of this imam, who feel such persecution from Israel and the USA. The people who live in these countries are the enemy, and they're all sub-humans, and "bad." Kind of like Robert Spencer says about the Muslim countries!

Is that fair for me to say about Robert Spencer? He writes in the way I have an appreciation for, not stuffy but with tongue-in-cheek (from the above example, "Whew, that's a relief! I feel better already!"), so already he seems a little cool. (Unfortunately, from the few samples of his that I have read, he is basing his point-of-view on only selective sources, which is definitely not cool). Let's find out a little about him. He goes out of his way to appear balanced in the accounts that describe him and in an interview, but it is his writings that give him away.


Outside Opinion: Whom would Jesus hate?

(Commenting on a book authored by Robert Spencer)

The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades), which, I understand, has not even been released yet*, already is at No. 49 in amazon.com's top 100 as I type this sentence.

This ignorance-and-hate fest is in amazon.com's top 100-selling books. In Islam the pig is considered unclean, so I have to wonder how the pig on the cover is going to go down among Muslims. (Not that the wingnuts who like to endanger all Americans with their anti-Muslim rhetoric and actions give a shit...) The cover's claim that "Muslim persecution of Christians has continued for 13 centures — and still goes on" is kinda funny in light of what we know about what happened to Muslims at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq at the hands of "Christian" U.S. soldiers and how Muslims are still being kept at Guantanamo Bay Concentration Camp (gee, I don't know of any American "Christians" who are being kept at Muslim concentration camps...). This book will sell, despite its blatantly obvious distortions and lies, because "Christians" need to feel better about their miserable selves and their miserable lives by hating others — just as Jesus Christ taught them to do.

blogs.salon.com/0001517/2005/07/30.html


From the FAQ page on Spencer's site (as of late 2005), it seems he has gone on an anti-Muslim crusade of his own, having written "The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades)," among other books. He received his Master's in "Religious Studies" in a university from the Bible Belt... and I don't think the courses he concentrated on were about Islam, since I don't think the "Religious Studies" major offered that many courses in Islam. It appears he is a fundamentalist Christian; he doesn't like Muslims, just like fundamentalist Muslims don't care for Christians, so he decided to learn as much about the Muslim religion as he could, to cherry-pick the "bad parts" and make other people hate Islam.

In other words, he's kind of like Vahakn Dadrian! (No wonder Prosecutor Dadrian has cozied up with Robert Spencer's Jihadwatch.org.)

Spencer has become a bit of a celebrity, to read his bio... featuring articles and interviews in some general, but mostly conservative publications and programs.

Q: Why should I believe what you say about Islam?
A: Because I draw no conclusions of myself. Pick up any of my books, and you will see that they are made up largely of quotations from Islamic jihadists and the traditional Islamic sources to which they appeal to justify violence and terrorism. I am only shedding light on what these sources say.

He draws no conclusions? What an insincere statement. From the articles that I have read, his lack of balance means only that he is drawing conclusions, and he would like nothing better than for you to draw the same conclusions. And of course if one concentrates on only the agenda-serving "bad" quotations, you are going to steer your hopeful converts in the direction you choose. It's like if only the medieval quotations from the Bible are presented to make Christianity appear to be evil, and to make it seem as though all Christians think the same way. It's like the Armenian "Genocide," only presenting the facts from the anti-Turkish racists and others who have an agenda.

"Since childhood I have had an interest in the Muslim world, from which my family comes." Spencer reports later on. Since I don't think his family is Muslim ("Spencer" does not sound very Muslim, for one thing), maybe he means he had a missionary family. He should have elaborated on this important point, his origin and influence. Why didn't he? Perhaps he would then come across as... less objective? (He's actually trying to make it seem as though he were more objective, given that his family came from the Muslim world, and that he was so at one with the Muslims.)

In response to "Q: Why do so many people convert to Islam?" Spencer says many sensible things, including "The global jihad against the West today also helps Islam gather converts in the West from among groups that feel themselves to be oppressed or marginalized." Hey, maybe this fellow isn't so... one-sided after all? Not so fast, Kowalski! Remember, this is the FAQ section of his site where he must come across as "fair."

Q: Do you hate Muslims?
A: Of course not. Islam is not a monolith, and never have I said or written anything that characterizes all Muslims as terrorist or given to violence. I am only calling attention to the roots and goals of jihad violence. Any Muslim who renounces violent jihad and dhimmitude is welcome to join in our anti-jihadist efforts. Any hate in my books comes from Muslim sources I quote, not from me. Cries of "hatred" and "bigotry" are effectively used by American Muslim advocacy groups to try to stifle the debate about the terrorist threat. But there is no substance to them.

To this, I say don't talk the cheap talk but do the more strenuous walk. He's an intelligent man, and hopefully that means he doesn't believe all Muslims are evil. Yet the context of the few articles of his that I've read definitely gives the impression that Islam is a monolith. The example we have from above, "Islam 'will never support terror or violence'," gives nothing short of the idea. It's not a criticism of one two-faced imam. It's meant to show the hypocrisy of Muslims who say Islam is a religion of peace, thus denouncing all Muslims.

For example, take a look at the following:

Because persecution of Jews opposes the view of human beings and the love of one's neighbour which is a consequence of the gospel that the church of Jesus Christ has the task to preach. Christ knows of no respect of persons, and he has taught us to see that every human life is costly to God. "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus." (Gal 3.28)

This, to me, is what a true Christian would be about. There are counterparts to the above in the Koran, that I've read in articles, similarly highlighting the value of all humanity. Now here is a mild description from the missionary, Clarence Ussher:

"Turks were callous, indifferent to each other’s sufferings, utterly selfish….Very few could be got to do a hand’s turn of work for the common good…They were filthy beyond description."

This kind of thinking was the rule, not the exception, from devout Christians of the period... Arnold Toynbee, James Bryce, Woodrow Wilson, Consul George Horton who thought of all Turks as "The Blight of Asia," and Cardinal Newman (from an earlier period, I believe) who likened the Turks to barbarians and the "great anti-Christ among the races of men."

Are we now to dismiss all Christians as hopeless racists, who certainly believe some humans are more equal than others, which says little about their concern for "human rights and dignity"?


Spencer continues:

Am I "anti-Muslim"? Some time ago here at Jihad Watch I had an exchange with an English convert to Islam. I said: "I would like nothing better than a flowering, a renaissance, in the Muslim world, including full equality of rights for women and non-Muslims in Islamic societies: freedom of conscience, equality in laws regarding legal testimony, equal employment opportunities, etc." Is all that "anti-Muslim"? My correspondent thought so. He responded: "So, you would like to see us ditch much of our religion and, thereby, become non-Muslims."

What does Spencer mean by an "Islamic society"? If he means a society ruled by religion, as with Iran, then we are not going to have those freedoms any more than if we had a medieval Christian society run by fundamentalists. Back in the days of the Byzantine Empire, the ruling Christian class would not grant freedoms even to fellow Christians, like the Armenians.

But if he's talking about a secular country that is predominantly Muslim, then we have all those elements. I hope one day more "Islamic societies" will become secular. But in Turkey, the ideals Spencer refers to exist, for the most part. (Maybe not to the extent we have them in America, but not all democracies are created equally. You can't even say some things in France or Switzerland, without getting hauled into court.)

So if Turkey, which Spencer would brand as another Islamic society, has these elements... does Turkey consider itself "anti-Muslim"? If his correspondent thought such matters as equality and freedom of conscience were "anti-Muslim," then wouldn't that have been one Muslim's opinion?

People are people everywhere. All people cherish qualities such as equality and freedom. Only abnormal, extremely religious minds would think differently, with their belief in a higher power. Yet because of this one Muslim's opinion, Spencer is indirectly telling us Muslims must not be that human, because they don't appreciate freedom and equality. More talk like that, and I'm going to start questioning Spencer's assertion that "Islam is not a monolith."

"In other words, he saw a call for equality of rights for women and non-Muslims in Islamic societies, including freedom of conscience, equality in laws regarding legal testimony, and equal employment opportunities, as a challenge to his religion," Spencer clarifies. I have news for Spencer: so would Christian and Jewish fundamentalists.

By the way: Spencer appears to do his best to brand Turkey as a Muslim monster, too.

Years ago, the faithful of Algeria voted to have an Islamic government, practicing their own limited democracy. The government realized the running of the country by religious extremists would amount to no good, and chose the lesser of two evils... to not accept the decision. Does everyone remember the outcry of Europe, protesting against the hijacking of a democratic vote? As if the world would have been better off with another religious government.

Q: Are you trying to incite anti-Muslim hatred?
A: Certainly not. I am trying to point out the depth and extent of the hatred that is directed against the United States, because I believe that the efforts to downplay its depth and extent leave us less equipped to defend ourselves.

I am not sure if the way to "defend ourselves" is to incite anti-Muslim hatred, which is what Spencer is doing, whether he is upfront about admitting it, or not. The way for effective defense lies in understanding. Yes, there are Muslims who have come to despise the United States. Did these Muslims suddenly say to themselves, oh, let's hate the USA, that might be fun? Just like with the causes for what happened with the Armenians in 1915, which Robert Spencer similarly chooses to ignore, we must look at the root causes for this hatred. For example, what was the power behind Iran before the ayatollahs took over? Can it be said the USA bears responsibility for the awful society Iran has become, under the control of these corrupt mullahs? If Iraq becomes a more religious society as there are signs at the time of this writing, as horrible as Iraq's previous government was, would that have taken place in a vacuum? When we understand the hatred, and if we have enough courage and integrity, then we can deal with it. The way to stop the hatred is not to create further hatred.

In other words, the "roots of the terrorist threat" do not lie with the more medieval quotations of the Koran, as Spencer deceptively would have us believe. Those medieval quotes were there in 1660, 1760, in 1860 and in 1960... yet there was no terrorist threat from Islamists against the West. (Historically, the Ottoman Empire represented the only threat; after its military power declined, they became the ones threatened.) Those medieval quotes are going to remain, whether we like them or not, just like the medieval quotes of the Bible are not going to be "updated." When a Christian fundamentalist murders an abortion doctor, will Robert Spencer advocate changing the Bible? (Not that he's advocating change; what Spencer is suggesting is "confronting the texts of the Qur'an, Hadith, and Sira that are used to justify violence against unbelievers, and decisively rejecting Qur'anic literalism." But you can't reason with a religious fanatic who is going to take any holy book quite literally. Maybe the logical answer would be to go the way of John Lennon, and Imagine there's no religion.)

The answer, my friends, is not blowing in the wind, here. The answer in defusing these problems lies with understanding and friendship, not bullying and domination. That is no easy answer, especially with the deeply established antagonisms, and (perhaps more importantly) the profits at stake.

("Arabic-speaking Christians use 'Allah' for the God of the Bible" That's interesting! One way for Islamophobes to create distance is to make it seem like "Allah" is an altogether different God... although that is just the word for "god" in another language, like "dios" in Spanish. Once again, trying to find ways to tear us apart instead of bringing us together.)


Moving on to "An Interview With Robert Spencer" from Right Wing News (www.rightwingnews.com/interviews/spencer.php)

John Hawkins: Why haven't moderate Muslims been able to stop the spread of violent Islam?

Robert Spencer: While there are moderate Muslims, moderate Islam is something else again. There are Muslims who are very peaceful people, who would never wage jihad, and who don't approve of those waging jihad in the name of Islam today. But the fact is that the radicals actually do have a stronger theoretical, theological, and legal basis within Islam for what they believe than the moderates do. They're able to intimidate moderates into silence because if the moderates speak out, they're labeled as disloyal to the religion.

Ironically, what Spencer is describing is exactly what has happened, and continues happening, with the Armenians. Moderate Armenians don't dare publicly speak out against their false genocide, because the fanatical Dashnaks have ways of silencing them. If Spencer were a little more honest and/or educated, the irony of his words would hit him hard.

"There are Muslims who are very peaceful people..." The truth is, MOST Muslims are peaceful, not just some fringe element. [The interviewer, John Hawkins, informs us that according to congressman Tom Tancredo, "...relatively few, less than 10% of the Muslim population (can be) categorize(d) as (supporters of) terrorists." Spencer replies, "the theological foundations of radical Islam make it so that a much larger number of Muslims are in sympathy with what the radicals do even though they would never do it themselves." I'd say the reasons have much less to do with "theological foundations" — again, the implication that Muslims are primitive subhumans who don't have the brains to think for themselves — and much more to do with "political realities.")

Spencer:

"Back to the 1920s, certain radical Muslim theorists, particularly Hasan Al Banna & Syed Qutb, taught that no government had any legitimacy unless it obeyed Islamic law and that it was the duty of Muslims around the world to wage war against those governments that did not, Muslim and non-Muslim, until Islamic law was established. Those people would consider America to be their primary foe because America is offering a different model for the world. A model that involves freedom, equality, dignity, & rights for all, Republican government and so on. This is their chief competition."

There are times when Spencer's spin comes across as level-headed and objective... and then he involuntarily flatulates, exposing his true face. What are we going to do now, take the word of "certain radical Muslim theorists" and apply them across the board? Did Rabbi Meir Kahane speak for all Jews? Did David Duke, when he wore the white hood, speak for all Christians?

If America had left Middle-Eastern Muslims alone in the 20th century (along with some European imperialists in the 20th and previous centuries), there would be no Osama bin Laden today. It's as simple as that. Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with America being "their chief competition." If there were mad Muslims looking to make the world a more Muslim place, they would start with neighboring states that are either not Muslim and especially NOT AS Muslim to try and bully around, first.

Robert Spencer is asked about Israel, but only to the extent on whether there are "'Naziesque' levels of anti-semitism in much of the Muslim world" (which is not a brave question to ask about Israel). Spencer answers yes, and unfortunately he's right. Anti-Semitism is not only restricted to the Muslim world either, but Spencer fishes around to why there is this Anti-Semitism in the Muslim world. "I think that the Palestinians have to a certain extent, a legitimate claim," he says. "There are people...who were forced out of their homes in the 1940s," he explains, which would give them a legitimate claim to more than just a certain extent, but a FULL extent, as anyone who has been forced out of his or her home can attest to. (The number of expulsed that I had once come across was 750,000. America had something to do with that, if we want to get closer to the heart of the matter.)

(If anyone thinks about applying the above to the Armenians, don't forget: a good chunk of the pre-war Armenian population — about 1.5 million — remained at the end of the war; the Armenian Patriarch recorded 1,260,000 in 1918 and up to 644,900 in 1921. Armenians chose not to remain, for their own reasons. Both what was left of the Ottoman Empire and the new Turkish Republic gave the Armenians several opportunities to return.)

Spencer continues: "The fact is that the neighboring Muslim states refused these people asylum and the right to settle and build homes in their countries, because they wanted to use them as a stick to beat Israel with, and they have. So both sides have really mistreated the Palestinians..."

Okay. So those bad neighboring Muslim states were as much to blame as Israel. As if the USA and other nations, in refusing to accept Jewish refugees from Nazi-dominated Europe, bore equal responsibility to Nazi Germany. Maybe those Arab states had other reasons, such as being financially poor, and not being able to absorb hundreds of thousands. Maybe they saw these kicked-out Palestinians as a force for instability within their own insecure nations.

Spencer then goes on to explain that the Palestinians' suicide bombing "is a direct result of the radical jihadest rhetoric," but I'm not sure if that's true. I had read a Western study not long ago investigating the backgrounds of these bombers, and a good chunk, maybe the majority, of these people were not religious. The real incentive derives from hopelessness and frustration (not to condone these bombings; targeting the lives of innocents can never be justified). The ones in charge are regarded as occupiers, and there are times the occupied are treated brutally. The occupied have no one to truly call for help in the world, and America is seen as the main support behind what the occupied see as their occupiers. There is much simmering wrath, and anyone with an honest understanding is going to see "Islam" is not causing this wrath.


''Islamic fundamentalism has very little to do with it."

Why do suicide bombers do it?

By Christopher Shea | July 3, 2005, The Boston Globe

Four years ago, the late Susan Sontag was excoriated for arguing, in a brief New Yorker piece, that the attacks that brought down the World Trade Center were inspired not by hatred of ''civilization" or ''the free world" but rather by opposition to ''specific American alliances and actions." Today that argument--seen by hawks in those dark post-Sept. 11 days as treasonously empathetic--has become a commonplace in the latest political science work on terrorism.

No one, for example, is hurling charges of crypto-treason at Robert A. Pape, an associate professor of political science at the University of Chicago known for hard-nosed studies of air power in wartime. But Pape's new book, ''Dying to Win: The Strategic Logic of Suicide Terrorism" (Random House), which grew out of a much-cited 2003 article in the American Political Science Review, is prime example of the mainstreaming of Sontag's once-taboo view. ''Suicide terrorism is a response to occupation," Pape says in a phone interview. ''Islamic fundamentalism has very little to do with it."

''Dying to Win" draws on a thorough database of all suicide attacks recorded since the contemporary practice was born during the Lebanese civil war in the early 1980s: a total of 315 incidents through 2003, involving 462 suicidal attackers. Of the 384 attackers for whom Pape has data, who committed their deeds in such danger zones as Sri Lanka (where the decidedly non-fundamentalist, quasi-Marxist Tamil Tigers have used suicide attacks since 1987 in their fight for a Tamil homeland), Israel, Chechnya, Iraq, and New York, only 43 percent came from religiously affiliated groups. The balance, 57 percent, came from secular groups. Strikingly, during the Lebanese civil war, he says, some 70 percent of suicide attackers were Christians (though members of secular groups).

The thrust of his argument is that suicide terrorism is an eminently rational strategy. Everywhere it has been used, the countries that face it make concessions: The United States left Lebanon; Israel withdrew from Lebanon and now (much of) the West Bank; and Sri Lanka gave the Tamils a semiautonomous state.

Since occupation spurs terrorism, Pape concludes that America should ''expeditiously" (but not recklessly) withdraw troops from Iraq... (The rest is here. A 2002 article by Ha'aretz looks into what an Israeli official came up with, in regards to the motivations of suicide bombers.)


Vahakn Dadrian

Spencer: "Radical Islam does not believe in the equality, dignity, and rights of all people." He is right. But is there a partisan ideology on a radical level which does? It seems Spencer is sugarcoating with the word "radical," but it's not really radical Islam that he's criticizing; he is criticizing Islam as a whole. (With these sneaky tactics, no wonder Vahakn Dadrian likes this guy!)

Spencer and his interviewer discuss the impossibility of a woman's proving she has been raped. The victim becomes even more victimized by getting imprisoned for adultery or even stoned to death. A site in Germany, International Society for Human Rights, writes: "alongside the revival and re-politisation of Islam, a tendency of introducing shari'ah law has been recorded in recent decades. This mainly concerns countries such as Sudan, Nigeria, Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia and Bangladesh."

The one act of my country that I'm very thankful for, even if they did it for other post 9/11 reasons, is the kicking out of the Taliban in Afghanistan. I hated those worms for their abuse of women. And this described activity, similar to the genital mutilation of women we often hear about, is horrifying. Definitely a case where "Radical Islam does not believe in the equality, dignity, and rights of all people."


"Stonings for adultery happen all the time in Saudi Arabia & Iran and they don't make any headlines," Spencer claims. But since Spencer does not live in those countries and only listens to sources with similar agendas to his own, one needs to dig deeper to find the real truth. No doubt these terrible things do happen, and even if they happen once in a while, that would be once in a while too many. I don't believe they would be that commonplace, as the ordinary people of Saudi Arabia & Iran are not going to be so demented. I'm sure most of the regulars abhor such practices, and only put up with the times they happen because "You can't fight city hall." If they "happen all the time," I'd doubt even the governments in charge would get away with it, at least after a sustained period of time.

This is an area that requires in-depth research, and I was only able to give a cursory look. Another (seemingly) right-wing site had a forum that printed an article called "Two Beheaded in Saudi Arabia Over Rape." (www.rightnation.us/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t88447.html) "A Saudi and a Yemeni, were executed in a public square after confessing to their crimes." There were 65 beheadings in 2005 up until Sept. 21, 35 in 2004 and 52 in 2003. The first apparently American forum writer shared the approval of most of the rest. ("Neither one will ever do it again. In other words: GOOD!" Religious conservatives of all stripes love the death penalty.)

So at least we know rape is a crime taken seriously... much more seriously than in the United States, if the punishment is execution. The crime may be harder to prove; but nothing justifies the punishment of the victim, in these handful of radical Islamic countries.

A biblical counterpoint from answering-christianity.com (www.answering-christianity.com/woman.htm):

"If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, he shall pay the girl's father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the girl, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives. (From the NIV Bible, Deuteronomy 22:28)" The webmaster asks: "How is the Bible supposed to prevent some loser from stalking the most beautiful single woman in town, rape her, and then sue her in court to become his wife so he can continue raping her for the rest of her life?!"

I remember a story like this that took place in China a few years ago. Some rapist took a woman into a cave and enslaved her to the point of driving her mad. Since she became of no use to anyone, the local authorities then placed her in the care of... her rapist!

Just because I read that story somewhere does not mean it was true, of course. The point is, there are excesses happening everywhere in the world. I read a New York Times article not long ago where one of the main countries on earth supporting female slavery was not from the Third World, but the United States. As repulsive as these tales of stonings are from the radical Islamic nations, it's easy for those with an agenda to point to them as evidence for people practicing the religion to be the most inhuman on earth.


Robert Spencer wrote in Frontpage.com's "Jesus' Jihad?":

In the New York Times last Saturday, Nicholas Kristof discovers what he considers to be a disturbing counterpoint to calls by Islamic radicals to wage war against Christians and Jews: the Left Behind books, the runaway bestselling series of novels that depict the Christian fundamentalist notion of the “Rapture.” This is the moment at the end of the world when good Christians are taken into heaven, and the rest are left on earth to suffer the judgment of God. Quoting some lurid passages from the latest book in the series, The Glorious Appearing, he sees a dark implication of the fact that these books are bestsellers: “ordinary Americans joined in the torture of prisoners at Abu Ghraib in part because of a lack of empathy for the prisoners. It’s harder to feel empathy for such people if we regard them as infidels and expect Jesus to dissolve their tongues and eyes any day now.”

He evidently missed what Christianity says about empathy.

Holdwater: It's more than evident Spencer misses that there is a big difference between what Christianity teaches and how some Christians go about practicing Christianity.

Note how the above serves as a parallel to how "Mein Kampf" became a bestseller in Turkey, which Spencer brought to light (below). Because a book hits it off with a certain element of society does not mean this certain element would be representative of the whole society.



In his zeal to paint Turkey as another barbarian Muslim nation, Spencer displayed his historic ignorance by pooh-poohing the tolerance of the Turks. This is the kind of article where he reveals his true stripes, rather than the objective and fair judge he tries to come across as, within his site's FAQ page. Anything that shows Muslims as good people? Not allowed.

(It was on this page where he added the Ottoman Jew massacre claim as an "Addendum" [That's the word I use for my site's updates, as well!]. Just because some other biased person made a claim, it was good enough for the agenda-ridden Robert Spencer.)



"Why, of course. These sweet, tolerant Turks couldn't possibly be indulging anti-Semitic, Hitlerian thoughts. After all, the Ottoman Empire was tolerant."

Those were Mr. Spencer's words, from his March 29, 2005 piece entitled, "Turkey Shrugs Off Success of Hitler's 'Mein Kampf." His previous article reported there was a surge in the sale of Hitler's book, especially when prices were reduced by a third. (As comparison, he cited the lesser statistic of 15,000 in annual sales of this book, within the USA.) Spencer's conclusion at the end of the first article:

"Racist fascism has tremendous appeal to the world's dark hearts, and it will emerge in some quarters whenever there is social distress and conflict, as there is today in Turkey. No such platitude should let us forget, though, that Islam and Nazism have close historical ties that could re-emerge at any time."

In his forum, reader "Elephant" provides historical evidence: "Heinrich Himmler called Islam the 'perfect religion for war'."


In the newer article, Spencer objects to the following passages from the Reuters article:

"Anti-Semitism has traditionally been weak in Turkey, a Muslim but secular country that has forged close security ties with Israel in recent years. The Turkish Ottoman Empire offered refuge to Jews and other minorities fleeing persecution in Europe from the time of the Spanish Inquisition onwards."

Spencer's response:

That last paragraph is a textbook example of a beast that is slain in a volume called The Myth of Islamic Tolerance.

"Political analysts say 'Mein Kampf' probably reflects rising nationalism and anti-American sentiment rather than anti-Semitism or specific support for Hitler and his ideas."


Spencer: Why, of course. These sweet, tolerant Turks couldn't possibly be indulging anti-Semitic, Hitlerian thoughts. After all, the Ottoman Empire was tolerant.

Holdwater: The tolerance of the Turks is a matter of historical record. If the Ottoman Turks were intolerant, the Balkans would possibly be speaking Turkish today, in the same manner South America and Hawaii have been taken over by the language and customs (and in the case of the latter, the people) of their conquerors.

"Many Turks are worried their country is having to make too many concessions to the European Union as it prepares for the start of long-delayed entry talks later this year.
There is also widespread anger about the U.S. occupation of neighboring Iraq."

Spencer: Yeah, I can see how those things would drive people to read Mein Kampf. Why, just yesterday I was in a bookstore and I heard someone say: "I am so upset about the new earthquakes in Southeast Asia that I am going to buy a copy of 'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.'"

Holdwater: If Spencer is repulsed by matters Hitlerian, I wonder why there is no mention in his site about how the Armenians cozied up with the Fuehrer during WWII, how Armenians proudly proclaim their Aryan nature in often anti-Semitic Armenian Internet forums, and why there are practically no Jews left in Armenia today.

Robert Spencer is certainly pleasing the hateful readers of his site, but is not demonstrating very much intellectual capacity, in his zeal to demonize all Muslims. He displays a terrible unawareness of the factors described. But what can we expect? Like his "friend," Vahakn Dadrian, Spencer's purpose thrives on staying above the surface. A real truth-seeker engages in what Greek-Cypriot author Antonis Angastiniyotis described:

If you want to find more than one reality, you need to constantly dig the soil until your hands are bloody.

As far as the anti-Semitism indicated by the popularity of Hitler's book: that is a disturbing sign. The roots of Turkish history, however, unlike the countries of the Christian world, have been far removed from anti-Jewishness. In 1924, Haim Nahum, the last Grand Rabbi of the Ottoman Empire, said: "It is actually an understatement that there was no anti-Semitism in Turkey. In fact, there was a pro-Semitism. Ottoman governments treated their Jewish subjects with a special consideration and compassion as one of their own, as one of the most loyal and devoted subjects of the empire."


In an article entitled, "Turkey: prove it," General Brent Scowcroft (chairman the American-Turkish Council) is skewered as a Turkish hack. (This one might have been written not by Spencer, but "Jihad Watch Board Vice President Hugh Fitzgerald.") The writer is horrified that Turkey might become a member of the European Union because the "Turks can, by the rules of the E.U., move freely anywhere within that same E.U, and set up doner kebab shops, and mosques, and swell the ranks still further of those ever-swelling ranks of Muslims who, almost without exception, have everywhere they have settled within Europe made life more unpleasant, more expensive, and more physically insecure for the indigenous Infidels (and for other non-Muslim immigrant groups who, unlike the Muslims, settle in Europe without making life more unpleasant, expensive, and physically dangerous for everyone else)?"

It's a good thing Robert Spencer, under the "Do you hate Muslims?" question of his FAQ section, told us he was not anti-Muslim.

The article, after the rant above, actually goes on to say: "the charge that the E.U. is a 'Christian club' is nonsense."

Two of the three conditions required before Turkey can become a member of the E.U.:

1) Recognizing not only the genocide of Armenians in 1915-1920, but the "mass murder" of Armenians in 1894-96.

2) "Removal of the green flag of Islam from Hagia Sophia, allowing Western (and Turkish) artisans to restore, as much as possible, the building, and permitting the holding, in Hagia Sophia, of church services."

(I wonder if a requirement was made of Greece and Spain to restore mosques and the permitting of mosque services, before Greece and Spain were permitted to join the E.U. Assuming there were any mosques or Muslims left in Greece and Spain, after the Greeks and Spaniards performed their own "jihads" many years ago.)

One of Jihad Watch's forum writers, Chris, enthusiastically agrees: "Do not forget that turks/muslims are occupators,it is not their land!!!" I don't know. Around 600 years of ownership must be good for some squatters' rights.

It's usually the left-wingers who don't like the Turks for reasons a right-leaning publication explained so well. But when the right-wingers have their own bones to pick, they sure can lay it on thick. The latter group is influenced mostly by religious and racial reasons. Any way you look at it, the animosity all boils down to hatred.

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© Holdwater
http://www.tallarmeniantale.com/jihadwatch.htm

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